[Goku]

isleaiw1, on 20 January 2021 - 10:19 PM, said:

I am not sure why football should get preferential treatment, there is a lot of money in the game, they maybe need to look at sharing it out a bit better in the current climate and not expect the taxpayer to pay.

Didn’t have you down as a big socialism fan Ian

[isleaiw1]

Goku, on 21 January 2021 - 07:26 AM, said:

Didn’t have you down as a big socialism fan Ian

All in favour of giving where its needed, we may disagree on where the need is, that is all

[isleaiw1]

moondog, on 20 January 2021 - 10:38 PM, said:

The money in the game doesn't stretch down to our level.

Football clubs are more than businesses as shown by you being a regular poster on here...

Not sure that the non football supporting public (who are by far the majority of people in the country) would see it that way.... should we spend taxpayers money on saving normal jobs, feeding the hungry or supporting an industry which wastes an amazing amount of money on obscene wages. You know that isnt the case at Chesterfield (now ) but.....

I'm on a car forum too but I dont suppose anybody thinks BMW should get a handout

[calvin plummers socks]

isleaiw1, on 20 January 2021 - 10:19 PM, said:

Just like every other business... we employed 1600 people, and apart from furlough and some rates relief, we have only been offered loans, and at more than 2% ( alot more from what I recall, so we are funding through our own revolving credit facility).

I am not sure why football should get preferential treatment, there is a lot of money in the game, they maybe need to look at sharing it out a bit better in the current climate and not expect the taxpayer to pay.

Probably not a popular view on a football forum but football clubs are businesses - and not even charities are getting the help from govt that grants would be giving...

Not many businesses can survive monumental mistakes like continuing to pay off managers (due to ignorance of contracts) and spending wages in the region of half a million on SEB 😂😂

[moondog]

isleaiw1, on 21 January 2021 - 08:50 AM, said:

Not sure that the non football supporting public (who are by far the majority of people in the country) would see it that way.... should we spend taxpayers money on saving normal jobs, feeding the hungry or supporting an industry which wastes an amazing amount of money on obscene wages. You know that isnt the case at Chesterfield (now ) but.....

I'm on a car forum too but I dont suppose anybody thinks BMW should get a handout

In addition to the value to the community argument you are missing the point more tax payers money would be spent on furlough payments to National League clubs (according to the National League) than on grants that would preserve these clubs.

[isleaiw1]

moondog, on 21 January 2021 - 08:58 AM, said:

In addition to the value to the community argument you are missing the point more tax payers money would be spent on furlough payments to National League clubs (according to the National League) than on grants that would preserve these clubs.

I am not, covered that earlier. The NL could make that case but then the govt would still be making a special case for one league in one industry.

We've claimed c£12m in furlough payments in the last 9 months, but that is supporting 1000 jobs. The NL are looking at wanting £10m for every 3 months to support how many jobs? You have to be a big football fan to see that as value...

[boot]

isleaiw1, on 21 January 2021 - 09:10 AM, said:

I am not, covered that earlier. The NL could make that case but then the govt would still be making a special case for one league in one industry.

We've claimed c£12m in furlough payments in the last 9 months, but that is supporting 1000 jobs. The NL are looking at wanting £10m for every 3 months to support how many jobs? You have to be a big football fan to see that as value...

Not that great a difference if my sums are correct - Your average pay appears to be about £400 per week. Assuming 30- 40 employees average at the 72 NL clubs - approximately 2000 - 3000 jobs. Direct comparison with your 12m gives £24m to £36m required for football compared to your business. I would say you are doing rather well in comparison to football where the average pay might be much more than £400 / week you would think.

[isleaiw1]

boot, on 21 January 2021 - 10:53 AM, said:

Not that great a difference if my sums are correct - Your average pay appears to be about £400 per week. Assuming 30- 40 employees average at the 72 NL clubs - approximately 2000 - 3000 jobs. Direct comparison with your 12m gives £24m to £36m required for football compared to your business. I would say you are doing rather well in comparison to football where the average pay might be much more than £400 / week you would think.

Well the cap is £600 a week in round money. And ours if furlough so money in for money out, whereas a grant may be giving some clubs more than they would otherwise have received in revenue (and on that front we are about £200m down in the last 9 months)....

I can see why the govt dont want to single out football as being special when so many industries and people are suffering. I can see why the NL think they are a special case. And I can see some brinksmanship being required to get to a satisfactory outcome for all.....

But my guess is the govt will stick by their its a loan message, the regional leagues below will walk away from that being part time, and the outcome may be very unsatisfactory all round....

[LondonBlue]

calvin plummers socks, on 21 January 2021 - 08:51 AM, said:

Not many businesses can survive monumental mistakes like continuing to pay off managers (due to ignorance of contracts) and spending wages in the region of half a million on SEB 😂😂

Half a million? Jesus.

[boot]

isleaiw1, on 21 January 2021 - 11:23 AM, said:

Well the cap is £600 a week in round money. And ours if furlough so money in for money out, whereas a grant may be giving some clubs more than they would otherwise have received in revenue (and on that front we are about £200m down in the last 9 months)....

I can see why the govt dont want to single out football as being special when so many industries and people are suffering. I can see why the NL think they are a special case. And I can see some brinksmanship being required to get to a satisfactory outcome for all.....

But my guess is the govt will stick by their its a loan message, the regional leagues below will walk away from that being part time, and the outcome may be very unsatisfactory all round....

Even with a cap of £600 week it makes no sense for the Government not to pay grants as opposed to furlough money. Surely you can't argue with that ? How is that worthy of any sort of 'special case' tag if it simply equates to the furlough bill, which would be and should be the yardstick ?

This post has been edited by boot: 21 January 2021 - 12:07 PM

[calvin plummers socks]

LondonBlue, on 21 January 2021 - 11:24 AM, said:

Half a million? Jesus.

That’s an estimate on my part btw

[isleaiw1]

boot, on 21 January 2021 - 11:59 AM, said:

Even with a cap of £600 week it makes no sense for the Government not to pay grants as opposed to furlough money. Surely you can't argue with that ? How is that worthy of any sort of 'special case' tag if it simply equates to the furlough bill, which would be and should be the yardstick ?

Because they arent giving grants to other industries or replacing lost revenue, they are just meeting employment costs to keep those jobs open for the future. IT might be the same amount of money but the principle behind it is different - and when you make one decision you have to think of the knock on impact and all of the others who come asking for something similar after.....

I'd love them to give all the clubs a grant, I imagine rugby, cricket, and many others would fancy the same. And maybe some restaurants, hotels, etc etc. Where do you end?

[azul]

isleaiw1, on 21 January 2021 - 09:10 AM, said:

I am not, covered that earlier. The NL could make that case but then the govt would still be making a special case for one league in one industry.

We've claimed c£12m in furlough payments in the last 9 months, but that is supporting 1000 jobs. The NL are looking at wanting £10m for every 3 months to support how many jobs? You have to be a big football fan to see that as value...

At an average of 30 employees that would be > 2000

I expect there were far more that 30 jobs furloughed at Chesterfield last year

[dim view]

moondog, on 21 January 2021 - 08:58 AM, said:

In addition to the value to the community argument you are missing the point more tax payers money would be spent on furlough payments to National League clubs (according to the National League) than on grants that would preserve these clubs.

So, 3 choices.

Interim general manager of The National League, Mark Ives, has requested each Member Club to provide views on three points:

1. The operation of a Club Loan process.
2. The operation of a National League Loan.
3. A suspension to The National League 2020/21 season.

CFC must surely vote for 1.

Option 2 involves the discredited NL Board finding a formula for handing out cash to clubs. So they can whistle for that.
Option 3 means no potential for Wembley/Promotion.

[LondonBlue]

calvin plummers socks, on 21 January 2021 - 12:15 PM, said:

That’s an estimate on my part btw

Probably not miles off. Some of the contracts we were rumoured to be handing out during that period were absolutely ridiculous - Chris O'grady comes to mind.

[moondog]

dim view, on 21 January 2021 - 02:05 PM, said:

So, 3 choices.

Interim general manager of The National League, Mark Ives, has requested each Member Club to provide views on three points:

1. The operation of a Club Loan process.
2. The operation of a National League Loan.
3. A suspension to The National League 2020/21 season.

CFC must surely vote for 1.

Option 2 involves the discredited NL Board finding a formula for handing out cash to clubs. So they can whistle for that.
Option 3 means no potential for Wembley/Promotion.

The formula for option 2 has to be signed off by Sport England. I'd be tempted to trust them and us not incur any liability. As stated earlier reduced central funding to a league we hopefully won't be part of long term ought not to concern us too much.

[moondog]

Slough Town from National League South have shared what they have sent to the league


https://sloughtownfc...National-League

The directors of Slough Town Football Club sent the following email to Mark Ives, Interim General Manager of The National League last night in response to his request for feedback on the three options discussing during yesterday's meeting with member clubs.

Dear Mark,

We have this evening given consideration to the 3 options presented to us today.

We would support OPTION 3, which is, as you know what we have been suggesting for some time now.

Neither Option 1 or 2 make any sense from a business perspective and we are not prepared to put our club into a long term financially unsustainable position by taking loans or a grant which is repayable (which is in effect what Option 2 is).

Given the need for a speedy decision on the part of the clubs, we would expect that a similarly quick decision will be taken by the board and any suspension to be in place before Saturday.

By playing fixtures on Saturday, clubs will have to pay their players an additional week and in our case, incur the biggest travel cost of the season. As soon as the decision is made to suspend, we can move our players to furlough, thus avoiding further costs, If the decision is to suspend, it MUST be made immediately. As a club we will go as far as to say that we do not propose to travel to Eastbourne on Saturday to fulfil a fixture which could be meaningless, incur unnecessary costs and put our players at risk.

We will have a separate discussion regarding Saturday with the Fixtures team and also with Eastbourne, but our position is clear. The issue can be avoided, by making your decision prior to the weekend.

[moondog]

Havant & Waterlooville says it's "not safe to play in this current climate".

The club says it won’t play their next 3 fixtures (Concord, Dorking & Braintree)

The Board has decided that the club will put itself into a ‘10 day self-isolation break’.

They say it has nothing to do with funding

https://t.co/lxEaazbIL8 https://t.co/NeaS1v6BR9


Concord Rangers have also said they won't play on until they receive more information from the league.

[isleaiw1]

My guess would be that if you refuse to play without good reason and before a ruling by the League, they will forfeit the points.

As for Slough, they expect the League to meet on Friday and stop all the games on Saturday.... what about all the teams that have done all the prep ready to play, including any that have travelled and are doing an overnight?

Seems to me like they are desperately short of cash...but wont take out a loan to fund the shortfall.

[moondog]

isleaiw1, on 21 January 2021 - 04:50 PM, said:

My guess would be that if you refuse to play without good reason and before a ruling by the League, they will forfeit the points.

As for Slough, they expect the League to meet on Friday and stop all the games on Saturday.... what about all the teams that have done all the prep ready to play, including any that have travelled and are doing an overnight?

Seems to me like they are desperately short of cash...but wont take out a loan to fund the shortfall.

You are right they are risking a 3 point deduction or a fine.

League rule 8.39