[buxton blue]

Mr.Spireite, on Nov 2 2006, 04:52 PM, said:

Yes, you're talking absolute 8ollocks

Roche is a young lad who is still learning his trade. He had little to do on Tuesday against West Ham, when he was called on he looked assured and confident and dealt with everything that was thrown at him. Same saturday.

He is one player who could leave for a fee from the club because he is a solid keeper.

i think barry is a very good keeper given his age and not much exspierence at all and when your in the kop he does shout and scream at his players being a keeper is one of the hardest positions to play in as 1 min your a top player saving the game and the next your crap because you have missed a call i used to play for forests nursery team greenhill and lowedges as a keeper and had trials wth forest and your told your the last line of defence the players in front of you should keep you quiet and its up to you to save there skins when it goes wrong
and some defenders like a stay on your line keeper i was a come a call keeper and when i went from sheffield junior owls to greenhill the defenders and manager didnt like a come and call keeper it may be the same with roy we dnt now and never will but as for me barry roche is a top keeper and will come on stronger with every game he plays

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

sophocles, on Nov 2 2006, 04:49 PM, said:

What a ludicrous subject; somebody who hardly ever sees Town play comes out and lays into the keeper. As those who do see Town regularly know, Roche is one of the best goalkeepers in our division, and as a shot - stopper he is easily the BEST. He has greatly improved his area dominance, which was weak last season, and his decision making is now at least average to quite good. The other thing to remember is that if he was brilliant at everything he'd be playing for another team in blue called Chelsea; in other words, get real and appreciate our players for the level they are playing at.

Do you think he is good with crosses across his 6 yard box Soph?

[viewfromcompton]

sophocles, on Nov 2 2006, 04:49 PM, said:

What a ludicrous subject; somebody who hardly ever sees Town play comes out and lays into the keeper. As those who do see Town regularly know, Roche is one of the best goalkeepers in our division, and as a shot - stopper he is easily the BEST. He has greatly improved his area dominance, which was weak last season, and his decision making is now at least average to quite good. The other thing to remember is that if he was brilliant at everything he'd be playing for another team in blue called Chelsea; in other words, get real and appreciate our players for the level they are playing at.

Thank you for your response Sir !
You will find most goalkeepers are good shot stoppers, but the important thing is commanding the defence !!
You must admit he's a bit rooted to the line !.......................Your comparison from where he is to being brilliant is a bit confusing , is there no middle ground ?

[spiriete kev]

Mr.Spireite, on Nov 2 2006, 04:52 PM, said:

Yes, you're talking absolute 8ollocks

Roche is a young lad who is still learning his trade. He had little to do on Tuesday against West Ham, when he was called on he looked assured and confident and dealt with everything that was thrown at him. Same saturday.

He is one player who could leave for a fee from the club because he is a solid keeper.

Totaly agree hes only a young lad learning his trade,and he will make mistakes and when he does we all see them,because it will usally end up the back of the net.Dont get on his back because if he was the finished artical he would not be at chesterfield we would not be able to afford him.Lets hope he fills the potential he has shown and he will make us some money.

[Balearic Mac]

sophocles, on Nov 2 2006, 04:49 PM, said:

What a ludicrous subject; somebody who hardly ever sees Town play comes out and lays into the keeper. As those who do see Town regularly know, Roche is one of the best goalkeepers in our division, and as a shot - stopper he is easily the BEST. He has greatly improved his area dominance, which was weak last season, and his decision making is now at least average to quite good. The other thing to remember is that if he was brilliant at everything he'd be playing for another team in blue called Chelsea; in other words, get real and appreciate our players for the level they are playing at.

Its a fact that when any keeper (regardless of what level he plays at) is referred to as 'a good shot -stopper,' it's just another way of saying that overall he's suspect. Roche stands about 6 feet 4 ins and is rarely effective at leaving his line and commanding his area. This puts an additional strain on the defenders in front of him and ultimately reflects in the goals against column. As with many players, whilst he all has the physical attributes, I suspect its some of the mental attributes he may lack. Judgement, anticipation and decisiveness are qualities that are difficult to teach and sometimes you have to accept that you can't put something there that God didn't..

[sophocles]

Ernie Ernie Ernie, on Nov 2 2006, 05:20 PM, said:

Do you think he is good with crosses across his 6 yard box Soph?

No Ern, that's an area where I think he WAS poor, but has improved to average; I think in that sort of zone he sometimes elects to punch when a bloke of his size could make a safe catch, so he still needs to sharpen up with that kind of cross.

[Wooden Spoon]

Balearic Mac, on Nov 3 2006, 12:29 PM, said:

Its a fact that when any keeper (regardless of what level he plays at) is referred to as 'a good shot -stopper,' it's just another way of saying that overall he's suspect. Roche stands about 6 feet 4 ins and is rarely effective at leaving his line and commanding his area. This puts an additional strain on the defenders in front of him and ultimately reflects in the goals against column. As with many players, whilst he all has the physical attributes, I suspect its some of the mental attributes he may lack. Judgement, anticipation and decisiveness are qualities that are difficult to teach and sometimes you have to accept that you can't put something there that God didn't..

i agree with you, but those qualities,certainly in a keeper,come with experience. roch is still only in his early twenties, and as the great kevin keegan said, a keeper isnt born until they are 30

im not saying he is world class, if he was, he would be earning more than we pay. thats why he is at our club, we are his level, so to speak.

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

sophocles, on Nov 3 2006, 12:38 PM, said:

No Ern, that's an area where I think he WAS poor, but has improved to average; I think in that sort of zone he sometimes elects to punch when a bloke of his size could make a safe catch, so he still needs to sharpen up with that kind of cross.

I think a lot of it is down to lack of feet movement, which means he arrives late and has to punch cos he isn't in position to catch

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

spireiteblue, on Nov 3 2006, 01:28 PM, said:

Roche is as good as any goalie we have had here imo,if he were brilliant he would playing for Real Madrid.

Roche is a good keeper at our level for the wages we pay. To say he is as good as any goalie we have had is way off the mark though SB, we have has some cracking keepers

[Dan_CFC]

sophocles, on Nov 2 2006, 05:49 PM, said:

What a ludicrous subject; somebody who hardly ever sees Town play comes out and lays into the keeper. As those who do see Town regularly know, Roche is one of the best goalkeepers in our division, and as a shot - stopper he is easily the BEST. He has greatly improved his area dominance, which was weak last season, and his decision making is now at least average to quite good. The other thing to remember is that if he was brilliant at everything he'd be playing for another team in blue called Chelsea; in other words, get real and appreciate our players for the level they are playing at.

Roche looked vastly improved against Oldham, he came and caught the ball and looked a new keeper.Impressed after making mistakes costing us he looked on wednesday that he'd turned the corner.But to be fair most keepers who are professional are good shot stoppers,they have to be or they wouldn't of made it to this level.

This post has been edited by Dan_Spireite_Fanatic: 03 November 2006 - 01:37 PM

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

spireiteblue, on Nov 3 2006, 02:21 PM, said:

Yep and Rochey will be a cracking keeper too Ern don't forget he is only young and still learning,we have all made mistakes in whatever we do,i think he has got what it takes.

Too early to put him in the cracking category yet though

[sophocles]

viewfromcompton, on Nov 2 2006, 05:24 PM, said:

Thank you for your response Sir !
You will find most goalkeepers are good shot stoppers, but the important thing is commanding the defence !!
You must admit he's a bit rooted to the line !.......................Your comparison from where he is to being brilliant is a bit confusing , is there no middle ground ?

Er.. I thought it was obvious that he IS in the middle ground, the debate is about how far along the 'progress track' he is.