[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

h again, on Jun 13 2006, 09:55 AM, said:

Well, you can't get much vaguer than that, since nobody knows how much Mr. Hubbard puts in, and estimates of CFSS contributions vary from your 20 grand to Pete's 70 grand. I presume you'd agree that there's no point having a new owner who makes no difference in the matter of buying and paying better players - so how much? You've been asking for the club to be advertised for months, if not years - you must have some idea of how much we need and how to go about advertising it.

IF something is for sale a value is determined by an accountant H, pretty bas really!!

Without access to any figures it is impossible to suggest a valuation, the club obvioulsy know details of the value of saltergate, the amount Hubbard puts in etc but that is part of the smokescreen. There is no point at all in having a new owner who doesn't put in more money etc but who has ever suggested there was? As for advertising it, simple, stick it in financial times and then advertise through the media news stories. Have you never seen a club for sale in the FT?

[h again]

Ernie Ernie Ernie, on Jun 13 2006, 01:12 PM, said:

IF something is for sale a value is determined by an accountant H, pretty bas really!!

Without access to any figures it is impossible to suggest a valuation, the club obvioulsy know details of the value of saltergate, the amount Hubbard puts in etc but that is part of the smokescreen. There is no point at all in having a new owner who doesn't put in more money etc but who has ever suggested there was? As for advertising it, simple, stick it in financial times and then advertise through the media news stories. Have you never seen a club for sale in the FT?

How much more money is the burning question. If you assume for the sake of argument the ground is worthless, as its value is to be transferred into a new stadium, then anyone buying out the debentures plus a few grand could become the new owner. That's when the trouble starts. If you were CFSS how much would you want to see a new owner handing over for a start and on a continuing basis, before you informed Mr. Hubbard and the Board that their help was no longer required?

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

h again, on Jun 13 2006, 07:14 PM, said:

How much more money is the burning question. If you assume for the sake of argument the ground is worthless, as its value is to be transferred into a new stadium, then anyone buying out the debentures plus a few grand could become the new owner. That's when the trouble starts. If you were CFSS how much would you want to see a new owner handing over for a start and on a continuing basis, before you informed Mr. Hubbard and the Board that their help was no longer required?

I personally wouldn't tell them their help was no longer required

[Wooden Spoon]

h again, on Jun 13 2006, 10:05 AM, said:

I understood you were going to come to some kind of arrangement whereby you were elected to the CFSS Board and carried on a fund-raising campaign by telephone and e-mail, which is a perfectly viable thing to do. I take it this is no longer your intention?

the offer was made and there were no takers.closed shop,it was easier to get answers in the old days of norton

what you want me to do, form a rival CFSS to raise funds?

to be honest h, after the last few weeks of "revalations" regarding the funding opportunities turned down/missed/ignored, i really couldnt give flying F***.

the green stadium, sponsorship(see mike`s posts) the fun day thing chris offered to do, the list is almost endless.

if we make it to the new ground "finishing line" and stay in this division i will be amazed.

blaming the fans thing. go back and read the new ground and stupid fans thread from the begining.

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

death, on Jun 13 2006, 08:20 PM, said:

the offer was made and there were no takers.closed shop,it was easier to get answers in the old days of norton

what you want me to do, form a rival CFSS to raise funds?

to be honest h, after the last few weeks of "revalations" regarding the funding opportunities turned down/missed/ignored, i really couldnt give flying F***.

the green stadium, sponsorship(see mike`s posts) the fun day thing chris offered to do, the list is almost endless.
if we make it to the new ground "finishing line" and stay in this division i will be amazed.

blaming the fans thing. go back and read the new ground and stupid fans thread from the begining.

It is but I'll just remind you of this one.

At the time we were building the new toilets at the ground I was working on a project that was funded from grants and believed the same funding could be accessed to fund the toilet build.
I spoke to one of our more distinguished fans (in the "other" spireite site we cannot mention chat room). I explained that I get involved with community projects/capacity building etc as part of my day job and explained that I was 99% sure funding would be approved. It was suggested I write to the club out lining the potential source of income etc. This I duly did, highlighting how I had become aware of the funding and what my job was. I offered to complete the appropriate application forms and would only require details of the project cost to finalise the paperwork. This was not an easy thing to do and some degree of knowledge in this are was required in order to word the application in such a way that it met all the qualifying crieria. Whilst this would have taken me many hours to complete it was a no lose situation for the club. If the application was successful then the club got the funds, if it wasn't then only my time and effort had been wasted. All that was required from the club was a meeting and a few details. I never got an answer to my letter or a telephone call to ask for further details. I believe at the time we were talking something in the region of 30k. They say you should never look a gift horse in the mouth but we appear to do it regularly

[Wooden Spoon]

Ernie Ernie Ernie, on Jun 13 2006, 08:33 PM, said:

It is but I'll just remind you of this one.

At the time we were building the new toilets at the ground I was working on a project that was funded from grants and believed the same funding could be accessed to fund the toilet build.
I spoke to one of our more distinguished fans (in the "other" spireite site we cannot mention chat room). I explained that I get involved with community projects/capacity building etc as part of my day job and explained that I was 99% sure funding would be approved. It was suggested I write to the club out lining the potential source of income etc. This I duly did, highlighting how I had become aware of the funding and what my job was. I offered to complete the appropriate application forms and would only require details of the project cost to finalise the paperwork. This was not an easy thing to do and some degree of knowledge in this are was required in order to word the application in such a way that it met all the qualifying crieria. Whilst this would have taken me many hours to complete it was a no lose situation for the club. If the application was successful then the club got the funds, if it wasn't then only my time and effort had been wasted. All that was required from the club was a meeting and a few details. I never got an answer to my letter or a telephone call to ask for further details. I believe at the time we were talking something in the region of 30k. They say you should never look a gift horse in the mouth but we appear to do it regularly

yep. still, two fans think thats great.

the only 2 on here who do.

any offer of help is turned down,IMO, because the cosy few dont want outsiders in on the act.

prog sponsorship (ref mike). valley boy`s posts. stadium naming. as i said the list is almost endless.30k as above. how many other 30k`s have we missed?

how much money has this club missed out on since the cfss take over? i bet it would be enough,over 5 years, to buy out or cover the debentures of the current board.

food for thought?

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

death, on Jun 13 2006, 10:00 PM, said:

yep. still, two fans think thats great.

the only 2 on here who do.

any offer of help is turned down,IMO, because the cosy few dont want outsiders in on the act.

prog sponsorship (ref mike). valley boy`s posts. stadium naming. as i said the list is almost endless.30k as above. how many other 30k`s have we missed?

how much money has this club missed out on since the cfss take over? i bet it would be enough,over 5 years, to buy out or cover the debentures of the current board.

food for thought?

you forget though death I'm just a lying trouble causer who prefers to stand on the sidelines and do nothing, so my offer of help doesn't count

[h again]

death, on Jun 13 2006, 08:20 PM, said:

the offer was made and there were no takers.closed shop,it was easier to get answers in the old days of norton

what you want me to do, form a rival CFSS to raise funds?

to be honest h, after the last few weeks of "revalations" regarding the funding opportunities turned down/missed/ignored, i really couldnt give flying F***.

the green stadium, sponsorship(see mike`s posts) the fun day thing chris offered to do, the list is almost endless.

if we make it to the new ground "finishing line" and stay in this division i will be amazed.

blaming the fans thing. go back and read the new ground and stupid fans thread from the begining.

You don't need any offers or rejections. You simply stand for election to the CFSS Board at the next opportunity. If you're so easily put off I really don't give much for your chances as a fund-raiser, to be quite honest. It needs perseverance , a hide like a rhino and an ability not to fly off the handle and take every refusal as a personal insult - talking on here's easy, mind.
Thank you for the reference to the threads. I've read them and nowhere are the fans blamed. See the previous paragraph.

[h again]

All good, rabble-rousing stuff. Unfortunately the post was to do with how much we might need to receive from a new owner. The inefficiency of the CFSS, to which I referred myself at one point, was not the issue -though far be it from me to discourage you from discussing it to your hearts' content if you want a real downer. There is another option, though - - - - - -

[skaw]

h again, on Jun 14 2006, 10:20 AM, said:

All good, rabble-rousing stuff. Unfortunately the post was to do with how much we might need to receive from a new owner. The inefficiency of the CFSS, to which I referred myself at one point, was not the issue -though far be it from me to discourage you from discussing it to your hearts' content if you want a real downer. There is another option, though - - - - - -

I believe an number of these people putting forward have very good reasons for not wanting to be on the board (or not being able too) like not living in this country! It is more than annoying how much this club appears to waste through what appears to be lazyness, in scenario above all that was needed was one phone call and could have recieved around 30k. The club doesnt seem like it can be a***d to look into the grants and information on clean energy funding. I spoke to a power engineer the other day and he didnt think it was an applicable idea, but that was a five minute chat with someone who knows what they are on about, why cant the club do this? I know they are all busy volunteers as wellbut on these things where a fan is offering to do all the work i cant see how this is a viabl excuse.

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

h again, on Jun 14 2006, 10:12 AM, said:

You don't need any offers or rejections. You simply stand for election to the CFSS Board at the next opportunity. If you're so easily put off I really don't give much for your chances as a fund-raiser, to be quite honest. It needs perseverance , a hide like a rhino and an ability not to fly off the handle and take every refusal as a personal insult - talking on here's easy, mind.
Thank you for the reference to the threads. I've read them and nowhere are the fans blamed. See the previous paragraph.

I don't think refusal is an issue I think it's not giving things due consideration that winds people up

[Wooden Spoon]

h again, on Jun 14 2006, 10:12 AM, said:

You don't need any offers or rejections. You simply stand for election to the CFSS Board at the next opportunity. If you're so easily put off I really don't give much for your chances as a fund-raiser, to be quite honest. It needs perseverance , a hide like a rhino and an ability not to fly off the handle and take every refusal as a personal insult - talking on here's easy, mind.
Thank you for the reference to the threads. I've read them and nowhere are the fans blamed. See the previous paragraph.

prob more chance than turning down offers, which is the current set up. as for rabble rousing, thats bull poo and you know it. if your not concerned at the club turning down 30k for example, and see that as rabble rousing, then your beyond help and not worth attempting to have a "sensible"(messbnoard version) with

see ernies post h. thats if you can read them through your blinkers

[h again]

death, on Jun 14 2006, 06:36 PM, said:

prob more chance than turning down offers, which is the current set up. as for rabble rousing, thats bull poo and you know it. if your not concerned at the club turning down 30k for example, and see that as rabble rousing, then your beyond help and not worth attempting to have a "sensible"(messbnoard version) with

see ernies post h. thats if you can read them through your blinkers

So you won't be standing for election? You're throwing away that 50 grand you could have raised for the club by selling sponsorship? You need to be more ambitious, lad.

[Town_Fan]

h again, on Jun 14 2006, 07:28 PM, said:

So you won't be standing for election? You're throwing away that 50 grand you could have raised for the club by selling sponsorship? You need to be more ambitious, lad.

When are the next elections? I was under the impression board members were voted on for 3 years. Lots of time for them to fit in to the apathy machine.

[Wooden Spoon]

h again, on Jun 14 2006, 07:28 PM, said:

So you won't be standing for election? You're throwing away that 50 grand you could have raised for the club by selling sponsorship? You need to be more ambitious, lad.

hey, if its good enough for the current regime to not bother, its certainly good enough for me to not bother with. . and you do so support the "actions" of the current owners

again, i have NEVER said i would stand for election. your words h,not mine.

ambitious h?i thought ships anchors like you didnt do ambition. call me "lad" to my face if you got the balls.

[Wooden Spoon]

MP-Spire, on Jun 13 2006, 10:33 PM, said:

I heard a saying recently 'there's only so long I'm prepared to w.9.n.k someone off before it's time to call it a day', how apt!

yes mr spire.

it will have to be something exceptional this season to tempt me to do a 6-7 hour round trip on a saturday.

[h again]

Town_Fan, on Jun 14 2006, 08:12 PM, said:

When are the next elections? I was under the impression board members were voted on for 3 years. Lots of time for them to fit in to the apathy machine.

Elections every year, members retire by rotation. Will you be standing, or are you too apathetic?

[h again]

death, on Jun 14 2006, 09:44 PM, said:

hey, if its good enough for the current regime to not bother, its certainly good enough for me to not bother with. . and you do so support the "actions" of the current owners

again, i have NEVER said i would stand for election. your words h,not mine.

ambitious h?i thought ships anchors like you didnt do ambition. call me "lad" to my face if you got the balls.

You rally are a hot-head, aren't you? If you think 'lad' is a term of abuse you're in for some fairly torrid times in the real world.
So why aren't you standing for election? You've lost no opportunity over the last couple of monthe to tell us how totally incompetent the current lot are, and how many clever schemes you've got to improve things. The fact that you'd have to work over the telephone is a nuisance, but no more than that. You come to Chesterfield every fortnight for home matches, so could follow up contacts then. What's the problem?

[Wooden Spoon]

h again, on Jun 15 2006, 12:07 AM, said:

You rally are a hot-head, aren't you? If you think 'lad' is a term of abuse you're in for some fairly torrid times in the real world.
So why aren't you standing for election? You've lost no opportunity over the last couple of monthe to tell us how totally incompetent the current lot are, and how many clever schemes you've got to improve things. The fact that you'd have to work over the telephone is a nuisance, but no more than that. You come to Chesterfield every fortnight for home matches, so could follow up contacts then. What's the problem?

you dont know me,what i do or what i have done. how are you in a position to judge which "world" i am in?
may i suggest that having worked,rather than holidayed, on 3 different continents i have seen far more of the real world than you have.


which country are you from h? you appear to have difficulties with english, so for the 3rd time(at least) i am not standing because 1, i dont want to. 2 it is not practicle for me to do so. mind you, i had to tell you 4 times i was a life member of cfss, so its par for the course.

there is only a limited amount that can be done by phone. for example, i cannot see any plans or drawings ref new ground to comment. any assistance would therefore be limited.
how do you know how many times i come to chesterfield? do you secretly monitor my movements? i actualy make about half of the home games. a 6-7 hour round trip isnt always practicle given other commitments




seems i am not the only one either h. see a selection below. far more people seem to be questioning the clubs/cfss inability to exploit revenue. the only 2 people who seem to support such a policy is you, and sophie. did the pair of you fall off the same christmas tree?





"The Director concerned failed to see the importance of attempting to develop a stronger revenue stream from the 130 strong Business Club by approaching its members in relation to promoting programme advertising, stadium advertising, corporate season tickets and BOTM membership. I was informed that this wasn’t the purpose of the Business Club and that the majority of those members aren’t football fans anyway so it would be a pointless exercise. He did say that if anyone from the Business Club wanted to come forward and enquire about such sponsorship / advertising opportunities then their enquiry would be welcomed by the Club.

After our 13 minute conversation, I was told that he was sick with suppporters like me who criticise but don’t know what they're talking about and he went on to say, that if I wanted to buy out his debenture then I could have a position on the Board and with that, he put the phone down on me.

Now just to put this into perspective, last season, I provided 100 stewards jackets to the Club free of charge, purchased a Centre Stand season ticket, 57 tickets for the Chatsworth event and I also renewed our annual subscription to the Business Club.

Make up your own mind."



"With a budgeted loss of £170K for next season, I think it's about time someone got out of the comfort zone and started to look at ways to increase turnover.

It's the whole antics of the place Chris, I reckon our contribution last season was down £1K, and this season coming, it will be down £3.5K on 2005/06 season.

I'm just buying a season ticket, they can forget the rest.

If people want to play games, let them get on with it, but once bitten, twice shy."



"Coney was merely an example. I would imagine there are a few local venues running well short of capacity and may welcome an alliance with the Club.

I agree using other venues to generate additional income, stimulate a demand and build a market for the Club is not ideal, but the likely success would depend on the value of the Club's brand and also the ease at which potential customers can transfer their business from one provider to another.

Many businesses have been setup that rely upon the plant & machinery of other companies in order to sell their products. For example, a print broker, travel agent, red letter days (bad example!), and a financial advisor, to name a few. Take the financial advisor, he may be heavily into bed with Norwich Union, all of his customers know they're purchasing Norwich Union products through an intermediary (similar to us selling an organisation's conference space) and then the financial advisor decides he's going to start selling Royal & Sun Alliance Products (similar to us moving the conference business to the new ground), what impact would such a change have on his business? If he's offering like for like products and added value to his offering, I doubt it would cause him too many problems.

At the minute, we don't sell conference facilities. If we did forge an alliance with a company to build a market for ourselves when we eventually move, do you think it would have a positive or negative impact on the Brand, considering that we could have potentially generated 24 months of NEW revenue, built up a customer database and at the same time, be well prepared for the 2008/09 season?

The best working example I could give although it's not football related, would be that of a Travel Agent. Take Hotel Focus, based in Bakewell, I know I could phone them, give them a location, a budget, tell them what type of hotel and facilities I require and they would come back with a shortlist, I select the most suitable, they book it, I pay them and they get their percentage. There isn't even the need for an element of trust here, as I, as an individual wouldn't have the same purchasing power as such an organisation.

Over the next 24 months, couldn't the Club work with a few venues, Ringwood, Chesterfield Hotel, Coney Green, Sandpiper, Queens Park and start promoting itself as a conference / conference service provider, surely it's a more realistic approach than battening down the hatches until 2008/09?"



"You see this is the negative thinking a lot of us have at the club, were doomed from the start!"

"WHY CAN'T WE HAVE SOMEBODY PROFFESIONAL
WHY CAN'T WE DO THINGS DIFFERENTLY
WHY CAN'T WE BETTER OURSELVES
WHY DO WE ALL KEEP KNOCKING EACH OTHER DOWN
WHY DO WE PUT UP WITH SECOND BEST

Enough is Enough why don't we all use our energy and passion and theres plenty of it around, just look at this board, lets demand as a unit what we want in the new era of the club, we are all proud of the badge, lets be proud of everything about the club, starting with the new ground!!!"

"Yep thats the real problem death, this first step to take when you have a problem you cannot deal with on your own is to admit you've got one. Its that first step but when you have done it things always seem better that there is a way out."



Trouble is Death will any of the CFSS be big enough or bold enough to admit it. If they stopped all strutting about like peacocks thinking there the best thing on God's earth and are untouchable the better for this club.

Respect is a big thing in my life, I like giving it and I like receiving it, do CFSS deserve OUR respect

I can honestly say I have experienced the 'Saltergate Factor' before.

In 2002 I worked for a company that supplied office supplies. As I was doing well and my boss was a big football fan and new of the routgh times we had experienced he said he would supply the club with free supplies, in return a litlle bit of publicity to say what they were doing, not one person would speak to me about it, not one I thought I was doing them a real favour save them a couple of Thousand pounds a year, could not be bothered to arrange a meeting to discuss it. I told Mr Warner it was disgraceful way to treat a fan with such contempt (on his answer phone for the 100th time)

Also Chris CFC offered to do a fun day supplying food, entertainment, music, bouncy castle etc all orginized by himself with all of the profits going to the players fund. What response did he get NOTHING.

No wonder his application form for season ticket renewal has gone in the bin. Its a crying shame because at the end of the day its the fans that suffer.

Until we appoint somebody with a total proffesional attitude to the club/promoting to the media this club is doomed and no amount of 'gems' and freebies that Roy keeps finding will be enough.

Yep Ernie that is why you will find they never attract new members, if your not in 'the gang' you will not be welcome, they will not see the facts that you cannot relax properly and be able to enjoy youselves. I went omn the bus last year (last resort) and all the things what people said about it were totally true. Official supportes bus is supposed to be the real characters of the club, welcoming a sense of togetherness, not 1 person bothered to speak to me all day, a proper shambles."



"At the time we were building the new toilets at the ground I was working on a project that was funded from grants and believed the same funding could be accessed to fund the toilet build.
I spoke to one of our more distinguished fans (in the "other" spireite site we cannot mention chat room). I explained that I get involved with community projects/capacity building etc as part of my day job and explained that I was 99% sure funding would be approved. It was suggested I write to the club out lining the potential source of income etc. This I duly did, highlighting how I had become aware of the funding and what my job was. I offered to complete the appropriate application forms and would only require details of the project cost to finalise the paperwork. This was not an easy thing to do and some degree of knowledge in this are was required in order to word the application in such a way that it met all the qualifying crieria. Whilst this would have taken me many hours to complete it was a no lose situation for the club. If the application was successful then the club got the funds, if it wasn't then only my time and effort had been wasted. All that was required from the club was a meeting and a few details. I never got an answer to my letter or a telephone call to ask for further details. I believe at the time we were talking something in the region of 30k. They say you should never look a gift horse in the mouth but we appear to do it regularly"


"lets get king phil on, he seems happy enough talking to other fans about fans ownership why not talk to us once in awhile."

"No reason why he should not officially on board, but spends significant amonuts of time there and must no some of the answers. As only Dalek responds to anything or takes anything forward just trying to widen the circle of people that may give out info. Not a problem is it?"



i got bored at that stage, but im sure even you can get the picture