DEATH, on 07 November 2020 - 04:28 PM, said:
Largely yes. If your not seen as credible, you won’t get the support of the electorate. It’s as simple as that. Wet lettuce leaders, policies that people had little or no faith in. No charisma, no credibility. No a good mix.
Look, it’s not the likes of me and thee labour need to convince, it’s the likes of Ian, and those floating voters of so called middle England.
Labour couldn’t beat Theresa May, possibly the weakest prime minister ever. They got trounced by BJ. Why couldn’t they beat May? Her government was in turmoil. Johnson’s a joke figure, one laughed at by people, but people chose him over labour?
WA ALL KNOW BJ LIES. yet, has there been a bigger lie than the George Bush inspired WMD and invasion of Iraq? It’s what politicians do, saying the tories lie is pretty much a given, but you imply it’s only the tories that lie. How many times have you heard folk say “they all pee in the same pot” when referring to Westminster? That’s not gonna bring about a surge in red votes. He a bigger liar than him isn’t going to work. People expect them to lie, we see them lie in interview after interview, not answering questions, deflecting with waffle - Red, Yellow or Blue. Pointing out their lies won’t convince people. People,just,don’t believe the vast majority of politicians.
Brown, well he was on a hiding to nothing. Tarred with Blairs Iraq war brush, and then had to face a global financial crash started by American banks and exacerbated by a greedy financial sector in themUK - buts let not forget, it was on labours watch that the FSA regulated this sector. Yes, the tories wanted less regulation, but Labour under Blair also eased regulatory interference. Just saying “the bad old tories said xxxxx” doesn’t wash with floating voters. People just expect politicians to lie. Mandleson being made a peer so he could remain in government for example. No one believes any of them.
Ask yourself this. Labour (not Blair’s new labour) have not won an election for almost 50 years. Almost half a century. Many who’d remember the winter of discontent are dead, many who’d remember the 3 day week are dead. Yet these traditional labour policies still get the thumbs down from the British electorate - so why do they persist with them? Why don’t they learn from the most success period in the labour parties history in government? And yet, it’s more than that isn’t it. It’s not just the “fear of the 1970s” Chris, far from it. People see the likes Owen Jones......and are turned off. The condescending manner of these types doesn’t make ordinary people think yeah, that’s an ideology I can identify with.
Objectively it makes no sense for ordinary working people to vote for a party dominated by Eton toffs, wealthy business magnates and landed gentry, so why do working people not go red?
Can't understand this vilification of left leaning commentators.
Jones and O'Brien?
Don't always agree with them but compared to, say, Littlejohn, Hopkins, Pierce, or most of those filling columns in the Mail, Sun and Telegraph they're paragons of humanity.
And I'll say it again - this idea of some intellectual elite talking down to working class people is the creation of the real establishment elite to discredit the truth.
Come on Rob, you're a bright guy who's studied how all dictatorships do the same thing. How teachers and philosophers and professionals and anyone who might challenge their lies are the first victims of any authoritarian regime. Stalin...Hitler...Mao...Pol Pot...the list is as long as it's disgusting.
Okay, on an entirely different level, but look at Gove and Co's 'don't listen to the experts' and Trump's 'sack Fauci'. Not to mention the utterly unwarranted attacks on Bozo's medical advisors. Make no mistake - it's all part of the same process.
Returning to the point though, our friend 'Paragon of Virtue' makes a fair point. Whilst some of us are still motivated by historical injustices the benefits delivered by New Labour - which should never be diminished by Blair's regrettable following of Bush - mean we live in a different world. That said millions of people are about to discover those tales of unemployed folk living lives of luxury really are tory media myths. What it's really like to negotiate a benefit system designed to grind claimants into some sort of submission. How false it is to say it's all the fault of the 'have nots' for being too feckless or idle or irresponsible.
Covid, like WW2, will leave the country broke yet with countless heroes who shouldn't be let down. I see no reason the increasingly impressive SKS can't replicate the similarly dour but respectable Attlee in offering a post pandemic, post Brexit way forward...
This post has been edited by The Earl of Chesterfield: 07 November 2020 - 05:47 PM
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