[s42blue]

EoC said last week he feels he knows how posters will react and post to topics, which I think is largely true. But here’s one I’m not sure how everyone will react to…. The death penalty. Last week in Alabama (where else?) they executed a man for the first time by using nitrogen gas.

“I've been to four previous executions and I've never seen a condemned inmate thrash in the way that Kenneth Smith reacted to the nitrogen gas,", Alabama journalist Lee Hedgepeth told the BBC's Newsday programme.
"Kenny just began to gasp for air repeatedly and the execution took about 25 minutes total."

Discuss. And if you agree by what method. What safeguards should apply?

No ranting, no nastiness , just a straightforward debate.

Me? I’m anti. Too many miscarriages of justice have occurred. Read The Sun does Shine by Anthony Ray Hinton. I think life in prison (though with fewer privileges than they seem to get) would be torture enough (I get the cost argument but this is about punishment). Don’t get all biblical and “an eye for an eye”….i just feel killing another human is a fundamental wrong.

[Westbars Spireite]

I have no particularly huge feeling on it either way but if it is to happen that doesn’t sound like the way to do it.

[Andy Spireite]

I don't agree with the death penalty in general but, if they are to do it, I'd prefer they chose a different method. What's wrong with a straightforward bullet to the side of the head?

The nitrogen gassing sounds awful, I heard that the gas could cause the inmate to throw up inside the mask and they could well chose to death on their own vomit. Needs a rethink and, ideally, scrapping altogether.

[Mr Mercury]

Westbars Spireite, on 29 January 2024 - 02:29 PM, said:

I have no particularly huge feeling on it either way but if it is to happen that doesn’t sound like the way to do it.

But if it was one of my family who they killed I’d hope for them to have a death like that.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

s42blue, on 29 January 2024 - 02:06 PM, said:

EoC said last week he feels he knows how posters will react and post to topics, which I think is largely true. But here’s one I’m not sure how everyone will react to…. The death penalty. Last week in Alabama (where else?) they executed a man for the first time by using nitrogen gas.

“I've been to four previous executions and I've never seen a condemned inmate thrash in the way that Kenneth Smith reacted to the nitrogen gas,", Alabama journalist Lee Hedgepeth told the BBC's Newsday programme.
"Kenny just began to gasp for air repeatedly and the execution took about 25 minutes total."

Discuss. And if you agree by what method. What safeguards should apply?

No ranting, no nastiness , just a straightforward debate.

Me? I’m anti. Too many miscarriages of justice have occurred. Read The Sun does Shine by Anthony Ray Hinton. I think life in prison (though with fewer privileges than they seem to get) would be torture enough (I get the cost argument but this is about punishment). Don’t get all biblical and “an eye for an eye”….i just feel killing another human is a fundamental wrong.

Anti.

Too final.

And whilst it may quench the mob's desire for revenge - not arguing it's not deserved in some cases, either - it doesn't bring anyone back.

Then there's the hypocrisy of states saying 'Thou shalt not kill' but imposing the death penalty themselves.

Also consider criminals facing capital punishment having nothing to lose.

Chuck filth into the worst hell holes possible. Let them live out their lives in unmitigated misery rather than offer any easy way out...

This post has been edited by The Earl of Chesterfield: 29 January 2024 - 02:48 PM

[spireitetoo]

Personally I'm all for it, given we now have DNA and can prove without doubt that a person is responsible, but only in cases of multiple murders, ie serial killers, someone that slaughters an entire family etc, as long as its proven without a shadow of doubt... but certainly not by gassing, isn't there a state that uses a lethal injection where the prisoner is put to sleep 1st..

[JonB]

I think the issue with injections is there is currently a shortage of whats required so some states have been looking into other ways of doing it.

[fishini]

Mr Mercury, on 29 January 2024 - 02:45 PM, said:

But if it was one of my family who they killed I’d hope for them to have a death like that.

And me. Good grief we agree on something

[Mr Mercury]

fishini, on 29 January 2024 - 05:46 PM, said:

And me. Good grief we agree on something

If anything it would be too quick!

[Goku]

Just a dreadful idea all round. If even one person was incorrectly put to death that is one too many. Always baffles me when people advocate for it.

[fishini]

Goku, on 29 January 2024 - 06:01 PM, said:

Just a dreadful idea all round. If even one person was incorrectly put to death that is one too many. Always baffles me when people advocate for it.

No problem for me. DNA proof needed. How would you feel if the victim was your child?

[Goku]

fishini, on 29 January 2024 - 06:40 PM, said:

No problem for me. DNA proof needed. How would you feel if the victim was your child?

Punishment should not take people’s personal very emotionally-driven response into the equation, the whole ‘how would you feel if it was your child’ thing doesn’t wash with me. If somebody punched my child in the face I’d want to stab them in the throat, doesn’t mean that’s a proportionate punishment.

This post has been edited by Goku: 29 January 2024 - 06:51 PM

[Mr Mercury]

Goku, on 29 January 2024 - 06:50 PM, said:

Punishment should not take people’s personal very emotionally-driven response into the equation, the whole ‘how would you feel if it was your child’ thing doesn’t wash with me. If somebody punched my child in the face I’d want to stab them in the throat, doesn’t mean that’s a proportionate punishment.

Punching them in the face is different from taking their life.

[oldgoat]

The death penalty is not a deterrant , if the state wants to execute somebody how do they find it so difficult to kill somebody quickly and finally despite super DNA evidence mistakes are made

Anaesthetists find it quite easy to effectively kill people every day

[Search & Destroy]

fishini, on 29 January 2024 - 06:40 PM, said:

No problem for me. DNA proof needed. How would you feel if the victim was your child?

Nah, too many cases of innocent people in prison

Then folk say “yeah but it’d have to 100% with absolutely no doubt “


But isn’t that always the case?

[turrhall]

I'm completely against the death penalty, but if it has to happened wherever, it should be done as quicker and humanely as possible. In a country where the death penalty exists, the punishment should be 'death' not 'being painfully tortured, then death'.

This post has been edited by turrhall: 30 January 2024 - 11:31 AM

[Goku]

Mr Mercury, on 29 January 2024 - 07:31 PM, said:

Punching them in the face is different from taking their life.

But the point is the same. Emotional responses drawn from very personal experiences should not dictate punishment, hence 'how would you feel if X happened to your relation' doesn't wash.

[Mr Mercury]

Goku, on 30 January 2024 - 11:59 AM, said:

But the point is the same. Emotional responses drawn from very personal experiences should not dictate punishment, hence 'how would you feel if X happened to your relation' doesn't wash.

It’s not dictating punishment though, that is dictated by the law. The example I gave was that if someone had killed a member of my family I’d be rather glad they died like the recently executed man in Alabama, that’s an opinion of how they should die not an instruction.

[Goku]

Mr Mercury, on 30 January 2024 - 12:10 PM, said:

It’s not dictating punishment though, that is dictated by the law. The example I gave was that if someone had killed a member of my family I’d be rather glad they died like the recently executed man in Alabama, that’s an opinion of how they should die not an instruction.

I was replying to Fishini. He asked how would I feel about my child being a victim (I assume of murder). Answer, obviously furious and would want to hurt the person responsible however possible, however that doesn't mean I think the death penalty should apply or that it should be carried out in an inhumane manner, despite my hypothetical anger in said hypothetical scenario.

[Mr Mercury]

Goku, on 30 January 2024 - 12:17 PM, said:

I was replying to Fishini. He asked how would I feel about my child being a victim (I assume of murder). Answer, obviously furious and would want to hurt the person responsible however possible, however that doesn't mean I think the death penalty should apply or that it should be carried out in an inhumane manner, despite my hypothetical anger in said hypothetical scenario.

So basically we will all have two answers, the answer that involves us and the answer that has us on the outside.
For what is worth my option agrees with EoCs higher up, Incarcerate them forever but in the most bleak environment, sadly in todays world that’ll never happen, likewise the return of the death penalty, so I suppose we are left to envisage the punishment outcomes.