[Goku]

Search & Destroy, on 03 January 2024 - 01:34 PM, said:

Thought as much, Unions causing collateral deaths acceptable


Thanks for confirming what we already knew

Google false equivalence.

[Johnnyspireite7]

Valley Blues, on 03 January 2024 - 02:09 PM, said:

Anyway, after the attempted derailment of the thread by the usuals, back on topic.

It was interesting that the BMA are stating they are not valued, reflected in their pay, and NHS bosses say things are going to be hit hard this week as they are already depleted due to high numbers of staff off sick before the strikes.

NHS staff get six months full pay sickness leave. SIX MONTHS FULL PAY.
No wonder there's a problem with sickness within the NHS.

They can do private work whilst off and being paid maternity leave. Claiming maternity leave from the NHS and working at a higher rate in the private sector.
It beggars belief.

Would a compromise be to award the pay rise but cut the sickness leave to something actually financially viable, stop the luxury of the private work on maternity leave and put a substantial period they have to dedicate their time to the NHS after qualifying?

I get the issue on pay, we all want more but the sickness leave entitlement in itself is worth thousands a year, surely?

Considering that they deal with the general public's illnesses it is inevitable that some of them, even when they take all the precautions possible (allowing for dodgy PPE deals made by the Tories to their mates of course), will catch what they are treating. They are the ones taking the risks to help people so allow them some leeway in that regard.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Valley Blues, on 03 January 2024 - 02:09 PM, said:

Anyway, after the attempted derailment of the thread by the usuals, back on topic.

It was interesting that the BMA are stating they are not valued, reflected in their pay, and NHS bosses say things are going to be hit hard this week as they are already depleted due to high numbers of staff off sick before the strikes.

NHS staff get six months full pay sickness leave. SIX MONTHS FULL PAY.
No wonder there’s a problem with sickness within the NHS.

They can do private work whilst off and being paid maternity leave. Claiming maternity leave from the NHS and working at a higher rate in the private sector.
It beggars belief.

Would a compromise be to award the pay rise but cut the sickness leave to something actually financially viable, stop the luxury of the private work on maternity leave and put a substantial period they have to dedicate their time to the NHS after qualifying?

I get the issue on pay, we all want more but the sickness leave entitlement in itself is worth thousands a year, surely?

Your first post was an utterly unnecessary personal jibe.

As was your second.

And third.

But it's others 'attempting to derail the thread'?

Ah well, whatever pampers your pomposity.

Reading the rest of this, it looks like a long winded way of saying you don't think doctors deserve pay restoration (yeah, let's not get tied up in stuff about them being 'junior' doctors, the kinda stuff which led to the forehead slappingly crass Richard Madeley claiming they're all essentially "apprentices" this morning).

Okay, fair enough, at least you're finally discussing the issue.

Though the sick pay argument - which applies to all NHS staff and only after the requisite period of service - is just another distraction from the main point; more than thirteen years of wage degradation now proving a key factor in doctors leaving the health service in droves.

Either way it might be a basis for negotiation were the government party responsible for those thirteen years prepared to take part in talks. As the Scottish government recently did to reach an agreement (around twelve percent last year and a committment to raise salaries to twenty ten levels over time). Sadly they refuse to do that, or even make any new offer, until the doctors withdraw the threat of action. Effectively surrendering the one card they hold.

So we have an impasse. The government and it's many mates in the media now vilifying the very people many of us applauded four years ago in an attempt to starve them of support, and a BMA faced with an even greater exodus of doctors who voted for action in unprecidented numbers.

And stepping over the performative hypocrisy of a Farage fanboy suddenly concerned over the wellbeing of those he's so callously deemed expendable before, it's worth remembering the money already spent by the government addressing the strike would've all but met a sizeable percentage of the doctor's claim...

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search & Destroy, on 03 January 2024 - 02:23 PM, said:

Hypocrisy?


I thought I’d given a perfect example of yours


Union led collateral damage ok

Israeli not ok

So how many air-strikes have the BMA launched against hospitals today?

To the nearest dozen will do...

[Mr Mercury]

When it comes to personal insults there’s no one gets as many as S and D just for daring to have a different view to some on here, ranging from bigot to very very thinly disguised calls of racism.
So Id take no notice of those living in glass houses complaining when stones are thrown back at them.

This post has been edited by Mr Mercury: 03 January 2024 - 06:42 PM

[isleaiw1]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 03 January 2024 - 06:20 PM, said:

Your first post was an utterly unnecessary personal jibe.

As was your second.

And third.

But it's others 'attempting to derail the thread'?

Ah well, whatever pampers your pomposity.

Reading the rest of this, it looks like a long winded way of saying you don't think doctors deserve pay restoration (yeah, let's not get tied up in stuff about them being 'junior' doctors, the kinda stuff which led to the forehead slappingly crass Richard Madeley claiming they're all essentially "apprentices" this morning).

Okay, fair enough, at least you're finally discussing the issue.

Though the sick pay argument - which applies to all NHS staff and only after the requisite period of service - is just another distraction from the main point; more than thirteen years of wage degradation now proving a key factor in doctors leaving the health service in droves.

Either way it might be a basis for negotiation were the government party responsible for those thirteen years prepared to take part in talks. As the Scottish government recently did to reach an agreement (around twelve percent last year and a committment to raise salaries to twenty ten levels over time). Sadly they refuse to do that, or even make any new offer, until the doctors withdraw the threat of action. Effectively surrendering the one card they hold.

So we have an impasse. The government and it's many mates in the media now vilifying the very people many of us applauded four years ago in an attempt to starve them of support, and a BMA faced with an even greater exodus of doctors who voted for action in unprecidented numbers.

And stepping over the performative hypocrisy of a Farage fanboy suddenly concerned over the wellbeing of those he's so callously deemed expendable before, it's worth remembering the money already spent by the government addressing the strike would've all but met a sizeable percentage of the doctor's claim...

were they not given 9% earlier this year with talks about a further 3%? so that bit has matched the scottish offer. Of course, offering to pay more over future years when you just get your cash from westminster is easy... and of course they cant deliver if they arent in power, which looks more likely.

How many on here have had 12% rise in last 3 years say?

As for the comment about not negotiating whilst on strike, isnt that the norm, come back to work, get round the table and lets talk. I wouldnt negotiate whilst you were holding me to hostage...

As for the comment about trainees and apprentices, bad choice of work, but inexperienced staff should be paid less than those with experience.... shouldnt they? And whilst they are being paid to learn, isnt it right they get a lower wage as part of their wage is the learning on the job they get...?

As for your final point, the amount they have lost on the strike will take years to earn back. One week is 2% of a years pay.... do they want 37& now to get that back too?

[Goku]

Mr Mercury, on 03 January 2024 - 06:28 PM, said:

When it comes to personal insults there’s no one gets as many as S and D just for daring to have a different view to some on here, ranging from bigot to very very thinly disguised calls of racism.
So Id take no notice of those living in glass houses complaining when stones are thrown back at them.

Who is disguising anything? He is an outspoken racist.

[calvin plummers socks]

Mr Mercury, on 03 January 2024 - 06:28 PM, said:

When it comes to personal insults there’s no one gets as many as S and D just for daring to have a different view to some on here, ranging from bigot to very very thinly disguised calls of racism.
So I take no notice of those living in glass houses complaining when stones are thrown back at them.

We all get insults - I get mine for saying hamstrings etc.

S&D gets his for his racism, homophobia, Islamaphobia, his hatred for women and his support for Taoist’s, and his views on wanting kids to drown. I’d say that was more an obvious choice for a response but it’s what he wants…

You get yours for thinking you’re an expert on every topic and hating the armed forces and loving all things Tory

[calvin plummers socks]

Mr Mercury, on 03 January 2024 - 06:28 PM, said:

When it comes to personal insults there’s no one gets as many as S and D just for daring to have a different view to some on here, ranging from bigot to very very thinly disguised calls of racism.
So I take no notice of those living in glass houses complaining when stones are thrown back at them.

We all get insults - I get mine for saying hamstrings etc.

S&D gets his for his racism, homophobia, Islamaphobia, his hatred for women and his support for Taoist’s, and his views on wanting kids to drown. I’d say that was more an obvious choice for a response but it’s what he wants…

You get yours for thinking you’re an expert on every topic and hating the armed forces and loving all things Tory

[Mr Mercury]

Goku, on 03 January 2024 - 07:25 PM, said:

Who is disguising anything? He is an outspoken racist.

Sort of proves my point.

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 07:39 PM, said:

We all get insults - I get mine for saying hamstrings etc.

S&D gets his for his racism, homophobia, Islamaphobia, his hatred for women and his support for Taoist’s, and his views on wanting kids to drown. I’d say that was more an obvious choice for a response but it’s what he wants…

You get yours for thinking you’re an expert on every topic and hating the armed forces and loving all things Tory

“Thinking I’m an expert”… i think you’ll find on a lot of subjects I actually am.

[calvin plummers socks]

Mr Mercury, on 03 January 2024 - 07:41 PM, said:

Sort of proves my point.


“Thinking I’m an expert”… i think you’ll find on a lot of subjects I actually am.

I can’t remember a single thing you’ve been right about

[clarevoyant.]

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 08:48 PM, said:

I can’t remember a single thing you’ve been right about

He was probably right that you wouldn't meet up for a coffee!!

[calvin plummers socks]

clarevoyant., on 03 January 2024 - 08:51 PM, said:

He was probably right that you wouldn't meet up for a coffee!!

I did DM

[Mr Mercury]

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 08:48 PM, said:

I can’t remember a single thing you’ve been right about

Of course you can’t you melt because you choose what u reply to.

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 09:01 PM, said:

I did DM

I never got it..if you go to your message history though it should be there so take a screen shot and post it here.
I’ve just tried to message you and it’s clear it’s not sent, if it’s sent it’s in your history. So look forward to seeing the proof

This post has been edited by Mr Mercury: 03 January 2024 - 09:07 PM

[isleaiw1]

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 07:39 PM, said:

You get yours for thinking you’re an expert on every topic and hating the armed forces and loving all things Tory

There are lots of people on here who are experts at everything...

[calvin plummers socks]

Mr Mercury, on 03 January 2024 - 09:03 PM, said:

Of course you can’t you melt because you choose what u reply to.


I never got it..if you go to your message history though it should be there so take a screen shot and post it here.
I’ve just tried to message you and it’s clear it’s not sent, if it’s sent it’s in your history. So look forward to seeing the proof

Mr Mercury
Sent 18 December 2023 - 10:46 PM
Is this getting through
calvin plummers socks
Sent 19 December 2023 - 12:43 AM
Yes - not at the game but hoping to be up Christmas Day for a few days.
calvin plummers socks
Sent 20 December 2023 - 11:33 AM
Did you get that?^


Can’t screenshot but copied and pasted - that ok?

Yours came thru as well

[Mr Mercury]

calvin plummers socks, on 03 January 2024 - 09:30 PM, said:

Mr Mercury
Sent 18 December 2023 - 10:46 PM
Is this getting through
calvin plummers socks
Sent 19 December 2023 - 12:43 AM
Yes - not at the game but hoping to be up Christmas Day for a few days.
calvin plummers socks
Sent 20 December 2023 - 11:33 AM
Did you get that?^


Can’t screenshot but copied and pasted - that ok?

Yours came thru as well

That’s from the threads though isn’t it?
Are you at Watford?

[calvin plummers socks]

isleaiw1, on 03 January 2024 - 09:07 PM, said:

There are lots of people on here who are experts at everything...

True dat!

Although I think it’s occasionally good to acknowledge a persons actual knowledge- for example if I wanted advice on pensions and hotels etc I would probably go to you.

If I wanted advice on driving around the U.K. I’d go to DIFH

If I wanted advice on the club mattes I’d probably go to DalekPetw

Similarly I’d someone wanted advice on injuries / conditioning they would prob come to me.

Not really sure what anyone else does on here for a living though.

[fishini]

isleaiw1, on 03 January 2024 - 09:07 PM, said:

There are lots of people on here who are experts at everything...

You fall into that category

[Search & Destroy]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 03 January 2024 - 06:24 PM, said:

So how many air-strikes have the BMA launched against hospitals today?

To the nearest dozen will do...

Several NHS trusts declare critical incidents on first day of junior doctors' strike

You accept the collateral damage yeah?