[PositiveOmen]

sherbet fountain, on Aug 13 2008, 02:42 PM, said:

"well i won't back down, no i won't back down
You can stand me up at the gates of hell
But i won't back down"

"You've got to go and dig those holes,
with broken hands and whithered soles,
emancipated from all you know,
you've got to go and dig those holes"

[Town_Fan]

Sammy Spireite, on Aug 13 2008, 02:44 PM, said:

agreed.

And there is also creating your own chances through skill, lightening pace, quick feet and intelligence.

And theres scoring from seemingly nothing (hereford at home springs to mind)

you don't score 20+ goals in a relegation side and be no good at this level TF.

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

[Sammy Spireite]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

He scored 9 goals in 21 starts for Torquay so average that over a full season of 49 games (46 league + first round of each cup) = 20.99 goals.

Its all about ratios according to you

This post has been edited by Sammy Spireite: 13 August 2008 - 02:21 PM

[Spired]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

He bagged 9 in 21 at Torquay.

16 in 36 starts at Chesterfield so far. He's capable of 20 goals over 46 games in my opinion...and it's not a huge stretch of the imagination looking at the above to realise the same.

Sammy Spireite, on Aug 13 2008, 03:21 PM, said:

He scored 9 goals in 21 starts for Torquay so average that over a full season of 49 games (46 league + first round of each cup) = 20.99 goals.

Its all about ratios according to you

Double posts but i think we both realistically covered the necessary point.

[h again]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

[h again]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

[Spired]

Well done folks...you've finally sent him over the edge.

[Town_Fan]

Spired, on Aug 13 2008, 03:22 PM, said:

He bagged 9 in 21 at Torquay.

16 in 36 starts at Chesterfield so far. He's capable of 20 goals over 46 games in my opinion...and it's not a huge stretch of the imagination looking at the above to realise the same.



Double posts but i think we both realistically covered the necessary point.

Ok if its all about ratio's.....

Ward's first 30 games of last season gave us 5 goals. How does that suggests he could get 20 in 46?

The reality is that so far he has 16 goals in 45 appearances. How many should he have had? How many chancves did he miss? How many points did he cost us? These are more important questions than harping on about ratios.

This post has been edited by Town_Fan: 13 August 2008 - 02:33 PM

[marlons curtains]

If Ward stays fit and gets to play regularly week in week out, without any niggles, pulls or strains, I'm convinced that he will do the necessary.
But will he be here after January if this is the case?

[PositiveOmen]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:30 PM, said:

Ok if its all about ratio's.....

Ward's first 30 games of last season gave us 5 goals. How does that suggests he could get 20 in 46?

given the right information, then you could work out how many of those 30 games were played on the left wing, and i'm sure the statistics would tell a different story.

[Town_Fan]

marlons curtains, on Aug 13 2008, 03:31 PM, said:

If Ward stays fit and gets to play regularly week in week out, without any niggles, pulls or strains, I'm convinced that he will do the necessary.
But will he be here after January if this is the case?

He may well do but you cant argue that he misses a lot of chances. It cost us points last season and it sounds like we are out of another cup at the first round because of them (not just his fault mind). We also have no other options which is criminal.

[h again]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

When has Ward ever scored 20+ goals for anyone?

I know you're the world's leading authority and the rest of us are just idiots who know nothing about football, but I'll let you into a secret about strikers - the best ones miss a lot of chances, the poor ones miss very few. A good striker will create lots of chances for himself by his clever play off the ball and his use of it when he gets it, but by the very nature of the game he's going to miss a fair proportion due to the speed at which he has to take decisions, and the crowded areas he has to work in. A poor striker will not get anywhere near as many chances because he isn't good enough to create them but he'll tuck away just enough of the ones he does get to keep himself in work.
Haven't you ever heard managers say they aren't too concerned that a particular striker is missing chances - the time to worry is when he isn't getting any chances?

[shaun1866]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:30 PM, said:

Ok if its all about ratio's.....

Ward's first 30 games of last season gave us 5 goals. How does that suggests he could get 20 in 46?

The reality is that so far he has 16 goals in 45 appearances. How many should he have had? How many chancves did he miss? How many points did he cost us? These are more important questions than harping on about ratios.

ok if we go on ratios i like his league ratio this season 1 in 1 just get off his back (i think you should change your name to town_hater)

This post has been edited by yes1866: 13 August 2008 - 02:41 PM

[Town_Fan]

h again, on Aug 13 2008, 03:37 PM, said:

Haven't you ever heard managers say they aren't too concerned that a particular striker is missing chances - the time to worry is when he isn't getting any chances?

I have heard that and its rubbish. Does the league have a "chances for" column? Do you get 3 points for making more chances than the other team? Are we in the 2nd round of the league cup because Ward had some chances to score?

Its not rocket science.

[Sammy Spireite]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:35 PM, said:

He may well do but you cant argue that he misses a lot of chances. It cost us points last season and it sounds like we are out of another cup at the first round because of them (not just his fault mind). We also have no other options which is criminal.

So did lester, he could have had 50+

So did Roche not saving more shots

So did Downes not tackilng more strikers

So did Niven not tackling more midfielders

points are gained/lost by the team not one player.

[Town_Fan]

Sammy Spireite, on Aug 13 2008, 03:43 PM, said:

points are gained/lost by the team not one player.

I agree the point is to learn and not repeat the same mistakes.

[spiriteboy]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 11:47 AM, said:

We had 7 subs and yet none would have offered us anything different up front. I take it you are using the word striker in its loosest term.

A reliance on Ward and Lester is going to cost us as last night proved. If Lester has an off day he cant take the pressure of Ward who will continue to miss chance after chance just like he did at Barnet and for most of last season. I cant believe we didnt sell him.

There you go again blaming Ward, and you didn;t even see the game, we played well in spells but were out played by a better outfit, and you, you comp nerd, in one breath are telling us we need more strikers in the next telling us to sell 1 of the only 2 we got.
My you really know less about the game than i 1st thought (****).

[S18Spireite]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:44 PM, said:

I agree the point is to learn and not repeat the same mistakes.

You're so keen to point out how many he scored in his first 30 appearance...good for you...so remind us again how many he scored in his first 30 appearances and how many he's scored in his last 15? Is that not learning? Not becoming a better player?

Ward missed chances last night, so did Kerry, Harsley, Lester...

Give the guy a break

[Spired]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 03:30 PM, said:

Ok if its all about ratio's.....

Ward's first 30 games of last season gave us 5 goals. How does that suggests he could get 20 in 46?

The reality is that so far he has 16 goals in 45 appearances. How many should he have had? How many chancves did he miss? How many points did he cost us? These are more important questions than harping on about ratios.

Are you saying that the stats lie?

And is it really that far a stretch of the imagination that 16 goals in 45 games can infact turn into 20 in 46 in a side that has an improved midfield?

[spiriteboy]

Town_Fan, on Aug 13 2008, 12:17 PM, said:

I'm not complaining about the match. I didnt go and therefore its hard to comment. However people are saying Ward missed chances which sounds pretty normal for him. He was the same against Barnet and only scored after Lester had done the hard work, it would have been interesting to see what would have happened with the one on one if we had still been behind, how many would have been really confident then?

Ward missed umpteen chances last season but people forget about this because he runs around a lot. The trouble is for every goal he scores he misses 2 or 3 really good chances. IMHO this cost us last season as our defence struggled unless we were clear by a couple of goals. Personally I would have sold him, he only has 1 year left on his deal and could be gone for peanuts.
I know I'm in a small minority when it comes to this but I think we could have done better by selling him for 150k and using this plus his wages to fund a proper finisher.

Of course he'll go for peanuts, according to you thats all he's worth
Who offered 150k, and were a league 2 club with the of the worst grounds in the country, poor training facilities, and a Bunkum manager.
so you keep blarting