[azul]

Westbars Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

The idea that the banqueting/catering can be separated from the football business is ridiculous. They don't exist without the football.

It may seem that way and that it is just an accounting exercise but you can guarantee it is not otherwise he would not be doing it.

The short/medium term aim will be to reduce costs and pay back his loans at the expense of the football side. Bad enough, but in reality the worrying thing is this might be the thin edge of the wedge

[DIFH]

Goku, on 07 February 2016 - 12:17 AM, said:

And Dave Allen just walked into this blindly right?

YES BIG TIME

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Thought: DA splits the football club from the ground and C&B but places the debt upon that side of the business.

Hey presto a debt free and eminently more saleable football club.

[60s 70s Spireite]

MDCCCLXVI, on 07 February 2016 - 01:46 PM, said:

Thought: DA splits the football club from the ground and C&B but places the debt upon that side of the business.

Hey presto a debt free and eminently more saleable football club.

Until the end of the first season after he has charged the club £1.5M rent for use of the ground.

[azul]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

Until the end of the first season after he has charged the club £1.5M rent for use of the ground.

How would divvy up his £4M share holding between his stadium company and football club?

[60s 70s Spireite]

azul, on 07 February 2016 - 02:02 PM, said:

How would divvy up his £4M share holding between his stadium company and football club?

I would exchange these for shares in a new holding company, which would hold shares in the football cub and the new banqueting company. That way losses from one side could still be offset against profits from the other.

And much easier than doing a partition or demerger.

[Wooden Spoon]

Dave In Footie Heaven, on 07 February 2016 - 01:23 PM, said:

If thats his only job ?

Who else does he work for?

[Johnnyspireite7]

a kick in the balls, on 07 February 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

Who else does he work for?

The Development Centre apparently is a separate entity!!!!

[Westbars Spireite]

azul, on 07 February 2016 - 01:43 PM, said:

It may seem that way and that it is just an accounting exercise but you can guarantee it is not otherwise he would not be doing it.

The short/medium term aim will be to reduce costs and pay back his loans at the expense of the football side. Bad enough, but in reality the worrying thing is this might be the thin edge of the wedge

In reality it changes nothing other than the sums. It doesn't make the club any more or less profitable and any potential purchaser will surely not be daft enough to realise this.

[60s 70s Spireite]

Westbars Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 02:21 PM, said:

In reality it changes nothing other than the sums. It doesn't make the club any more or less profitable and any potential purchaser will surely not be daft enough to realise this.

All true. But what if has a plan to offload the football club, and the buyer/successors are left trying to make money from the butt end of football without any external income streams? Unless the motive is ulterior, I just can't see what it is about. And so many questions. Would stadium fixed signage advertising belong to the football side or the banqueting? Same with wet and food sales on match day. How do you split the wages of administrative and marketing staff? Business rates?

[azul]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 02:07 PM, said:

I would exchange these for shares in a new holding company, which would hold shares in the football cub and the new banqueting company. That way losses from one side could still be offset against profits from the other.

And much easier than doing a partition or demerger.

What would stop him partition the club so that most of his shares are in the stadium company, transferring the non DA debt to the football club, charge rent and let the club sink or swim. If it sinks into admin then that debt would be gone. He could even try to get the football club back

[60s 70s Spireite]

azul, on 07 February 2016 - 02:34 PM, said:

What would stop him partition the club so that most of his shares are in the stadium company, transferring the non DA debt to the football club, charge rent and let the club sink or swim. If it sinks into admin then that debt would be gone. He could even try to get the football club back

Insolvency law. You can't incorporate debt.

[azul]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 03:38 PM, said:

Insolvency law. You can't incorporate debt.

That sounds good

But how does the debt gets divvied up if the football club got split in two

[60s 70s Spireite]

azul, on 07 February 2016 - 03:45 PM, said:

That sounds good

But how does the debt gets divvied up if the football club got split in two

The debt will follow the assets.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 03:53 PM, said:

The debt will follow the assets.

In other words the Proact Stadium.

Hence the fear Allen will sell the football club as a separate entity then charge CFC for use of the stadium and accompanying facilities.

Just what Elton John's 'people' did when he gigged here.

[azul]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 03:53 PM, said:

The debt will follow the assets.

So the debt would go to his new stadium company as you would expect that is where the assets are?

Even if the loans was to the original football club, e.g. the CBC loan?

[60s 70s Spireite]

azul, on 07 February 2016 - 04:09 PM, said:

So the debt would go to his new stadium company as you would expect that is where the assets are?

Even if the loans was to the original football club, e.g. the CBC loan?

Yes, especially something like the CBC loan as I would imagine it's secured on the ground.

[azul]

MDCCCLXVI, on 07 February 2016 - 04:05 PM, said:

In other words the Proact Stadium.

Hence the fear Allen will sell the football club as a separate entity then charge CFC for use of the stadium and accompanying facilities.

Just what Elton John's 'people' did when he gigged here.

That would be the traditional way of doing things although with a history of disasters who would by a club with no assets and a gun at its head

After this hypothetical split how much would the football side of the business be worth, his original £4M shareholding, or a split either arbitrary or some formulae based on assets.

[60s 70s Spireite]

MDCCCLXVI, on 07 February 2016 - 04:05 PM, said:

In other words the Proact Stadium.

Hence the fear Allen will sell the football club as a separate entity then charge CFC for use of the stadium and accompanying facilities.

Just what Elton John's 'people' did when he gigged here.

That has to be the biggest fear. I am sure there isn't a single case of club being successful financially whilst renting their ground at a market rate. One thing is for sure, this proposed split isn't for the benefit of we fans of our football club.

[valemadness]

60s 70s Spireite, on 07 February 2016 - 04:22 PM, said:

Yes, especially something like the CBC loan as I would imagine it's secured on the ground.

Can it be secured on the ground when the loan was made years before we moved to the new ground?