[kh83]

MDCCCLXVI, on 12 May 2018 - 09:25 AM, said:

The landslide that took out N. Korea's main nuclear testing site has a lot to answer for.

It, alongside pressure from the region's real power broker China, forced Kim Jong il towards reconciliation with his southern neighbours. Problem is that's got Trump's supporters claiming it's all down to his hard-line stance (or as some might say a few juvenile texts) and him masturbating his ego all over again.

But Iran is a far more dangerous adversary than N. Korea. And at the centre of a power powderkeg.

Meanwhile more Palestinian protestors die at the hands of Isreali troops yet there's far less attention paid than if it'd been in, say, Russia, perhaps...

Palestinian protesters? Hamas have said they will send soldiers into Israel to kill as many Jews as possible. They aren't protesters, (some maybe) they are mostly Islamic terrorists. If the Israeli's had not shot down these terrorists, they would have stormed into Israel and then how many people will have died? Innocent people? Probably quite a lot

[mr. smith]

kh83, on 15 May 2018 - 03:46 PM, said:

Palestinian protesters? Hamas have said they will send soldiers into Israel to kill as many Jews as possible. They aren't protesters, (some maybe) they are mostly Islamic terrorists. If the Israeli's had not shot down these terrorists, they would have stormed into Israel and then how many people will have died? Innocent people? Probably quite a lot

how would they have stormed into Israel? theres a big fuk off wall all round Gaza.

[Search & Destroy]

Rockets, suicide bombers?

A year on from Manchester remember

[mr. smith]

Search and Destroy, on 16 May 2018 - 11:31 AM, said:

Rockets, suicide bombers?

A year on from Manchester remember

im sure the vast majority of residents of gaza neither know nor care that its one year on from the manchester bombing, they have the same death rate day on day.

rockets & suicide bombers are used against Israel & I wouldn't try to defend hamas. the point was that kh83 was saying Israel was justified in shooting the protesters as they were probably terrorists & were ready to storm into Israel.
my point is theres a big fuk off wall all round gaza preventing free movement into Israel. so yet again Israel is the aggressor & gives hamas the publicity & kudos it needs to exist.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

kh83, on 15 May 2018 - 03:46 PM, said:

Palestinian protesters? Hamas have said they will send soldiers into Israel to kill as many Jews as possible. They aren't protesters, (some maybe) they are mostly Islamic terrorists. If the Israeli's had not shot down these terrorists, they would have stormed into Israel and then how many people will have died? Innocent people? Probably quite a lot

All I'm seeing is ordinary people dressed in trainers, t-shirts and jeans being mown down by heavily armed troops.

And if protestors had been killed on such a scale in, say, Russia or China I'm absolutely certain the reaction in both Washington and Downing Street would've been far, far stronger.

[fishini]

MDCCCLXVI, on 16 May 2018 - 05:41 PM, said:

All I'm seeing is ordinary people dressed in trainers, t-shirts and jeans being mown down by heavily armed troops.

And if protestors had been killed on such a scale in, say, Russia or China I'm absolutely certain the reaction in both Washington and Downing Street would've been far, far stronger.

According to you then if someone wears trainers, t -shirts and jeans they cannot be terrorists? Kind of makes you wonder how all the terrorists here and abroad ever managed to kill the thousands they have. Their dress code by your definition should have alerted everyone to their intention to murder.

[mr. smith]

fishini, on 16 May 2018 - 06:38 PM, said:

According to you then if someone wears trainers, t -shirts and jeans they cannot be terrorists? Kind of makes you wonder how all the terrorists here and abroad ever managed to kill the thousands they have. Their dress code by your definition should have alerted everyone to their intention to murder.

youre not much of a terrorist if youre shouting & throwing rocks whilst hoping not to get shot by Israeli snipers.

[fishini]

mr. smith, on 16 May 2018 - 06:56 PM, said:

youre not much of a terrorist if youre shouting & throwing rocks whilst hoping not to get shot by Israeli snipers.

Not the point I was trying to make. Many of the protesters would have been Hamas and were probably wearing the clothes Chris was describing

[mr. smith]

fishini, on 16 May 2018 - 07:16 PM, said:

Not the point I was trying to make. Many of the protesters would have been Hamas and were probably wearing the clothes Chris was describing

hamas have said 50 of the victims were members/supporters. highly unlikely any of these would have been from the military wing.
unarmed protestors are shot by the Israeli military, hamas can now use this incident to rile up local opinion & the cycle continues.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

fishini, on 16 May 2018 - 06:38 PM, said:

According to you then if someone wears trainers, t -shirts and jeans they cannot be terrorists? Kind of makes you wonder how all the terrorists here and abroad ever managed to kill the thousands they have. Their dress code by your definition should have alerted everyone to their intention to murder.

Come on 'Fishi', you're better than this.

It was actually a parallel to some of the stuff witnessed during The Strike when picketing miners dressed in trainers, t-shirts and jeans were themselves attacked by heavily equipped police.

No support for Hamas from me because they, like the Israelis, will plumb any depths in pursuit of their agenda.

[Wooden Spoon]

mr. smith said:

1526473378[/url]' post='1392991']
im sure the vast majority of residents of gaza neither know nor care that its one year on from the manchester bombing, they have the same death rate day on day.

rockets & suicide bombers are used against Israel & I wouldn't try to defend hamas. the point was that kh83 was saying Israel was justified in shooting the protesters as they were probably terrorists & were ready to storm into Israel.
my point is theres a big fuk off wall all round gaza preventing free movement into Israel. so yet again Israel is the aggressor & gives hamas the publicity & kudos it needs to exist.

It probably suits Netanyahu to have this situation going on. He can then continue to pursue his own hardline agenda as a “legitimate” defence of his nation, justification for “buffer zones” and for the West Bank concrete wall. Which is just a land grab by force policy.

[Goku]

and on it goes...

Israel need putting on a leash, disgrace of a country.

This post has been edited by Goku: 13 May 2021 - 12:46 PM

[Johnnyspireite7]

Goku, on 13 May 2021 - 12:45 PM, said:

and on it goes...

Israel need putting on a leash, disgrace of a country.

Hamas, as the ruling party in Palestine, aren't exactly innocent in all this.....they both need bitch slapping.

[Search & Destroy]

When Hamas can learn to love their children as much as they hate the Jews maybe the region can move forward

[Wooden Spoon]

Goku said:

1620909921[/url]' post='1581740']
and on it goes...

Israel need putting on a leash, disgrace of a country.

I’d agree with that, but then Hamas/Hezbollah etc don’t do the situation any favours do they.



I don’t know what the answer is, because I’m convinced that Israel (Netanyahu) don’t really want a peaceful negotiated end to this and the hardliners within the Arab world most certainly don’t.

This post has been edited by DEATH: 13 May 2021 - 02:49 PM

[Goku]

Johnnyspireite7, on 13 May 2021 - 01:25 PM, said:

Hamas, as the ruling party in Palestine, aren't exactly innocent in all this.....they both need bitch slapping.

How would you want Palestinians to react to the treatment they've received? Genuine question, this isn't me suggesting there's no better or suitable way to react, but what would you say would be a suitable way to react? Question goes out to you too, Death.

From what I can glean this isn't a 'both sides are equally as bad' scenario. One side appears to be the aggressor, the other side is retaliating. I don't know how accurate these stats are but it's a 10:1 kill ratio in 'favour' of the Israelis: https://ifamericansk...tat/deaths.html

This post has been edited by Goku: 13 May 2021 - 03:12 PM

[Johnnyspireite7]

Goku, on 13 May 2021 - 02:57 PM, said:

How would you want Palestinians to react to the treatment they've received? Genuine question, this isn't me suggesting there's no better or suitable way to react, but what would you say would be a suitable way to react? Question goes out to you too, Death.

From what I can glean this isn't a 'both sides are equally as bad' scenario. One side appears to be the aggressor, the other side is retaliating. I don't know how accurate these stats are but it's a 10:1 kill ratio in 'favour' of the Israelis: https://ifamericansk...tat/deaths.html

Did I say that Palestine shouldn't react? No I think I said neither side were innocent parties.....they should both stop shooting each other and sit down and negotiate properly, but that will never happen while you've got hardline nutters like Netenyahu or Hamas...There is an obvious answer but the loss of innocent lives who only live there by accident of birth would be intolerable to comprehend.

[Goku]

Johnnyspireite7, on 13 May 2021 - 03:27 PM, said:

Did I say that Palestine shouldn't react? No I think I said neither side were innocent parties.....they should both stop shooting each other and sit down and negotiate properly, but that will never happen while you've got hardline nutters like Netenyahu or Hamas...There is an obvious answer but the loss of innocent lives who only live there by accident of birth would be intolerable to comprehend.

I didn't say you said that, I asked you how you think they should react to the treatment they've received. Read properly next time please

This post has been edited by Goku: 13 May 2021 - 03:37 PM

[Wooden Spoon]

Goku said:

1620917825[/url]' post='1581772']
How would you want Palestinians to react to the treatment they've received? Genuine question, this isn't me suggesting there's no better or suitable way to react, but what would you say would be a suitable way to react? Question goes out to you too, Death.

From what I can glean this isn't a 'both sides are equally as bad' scenario. One side appears to be the aggressor, the other side is retaliating. I don't know how accurate these stats are but it's a 10:1 kill ratio in 'favour' of the Israelis: https://ifamericansk...tat/deaths.html

Dunno, it’s not a question that has a simple answer. If it even has an answer.




I guess the only way to react that would have any meaning to try to set up a dialogue with Israel- be it through the UN or whatever. I can’t help but think back to the Oslo accords, and the deal that Israel,offered at the time looking like a cracking offer given the current state of affairs. They were offered a large chunk of what they wanted at the time.




Maybe the answer is a not a two state solution but a one state solution, something similar to what South Africa did after apartheid- new flag, an inclusive one nation government of Jews and Arabs,all with the same rights, maybe even a change of name to something neutral but historically accurate like Canaan. Then both Jew and Arab can claim the land is theirs together.




But that just won’t happen. Both sides are too entrenched.




So the other solution I’d suggest is that Israel dismantles all settlements in the occupied territories and with draws to its 1967 boundaries with a U.N. Force taking control of Jerusalem, administration and security. Made up of troops from all over, not just the west, but Arab, western, African nations etc so no bias can be implied.

[azul]

Goku, on 13 May 2021 - 12:45 PM, said:

and on it goes...

Israel need putting on a leash, disgrace of a country.

Just wait to they invade the Gaza Strip - that’ll have real potential for a disaster with more than 2 million squeezed in to little more than 100 square miles