[azul]

KevinArnottsGoldenBoot, on 12 December 2017 - 03:35 PM, said:

I pointed out the context.

What was fishy is the consistent amount of no shows from game one to now, from 'paying' customers. As I suspected, this seems to be because we gave a load of free ST's away to 0ver 80's - as confirmed by Moondog above.

So nearly half of the no shows are people who didn't pay for ST's. Which makes sense to me. Don't panic. No need to call up Poirot or owt!

Hate to be pedantic but 190 (if that what is was) is nearer a third than half and you are assuming they don't all go

[Snowflake McBedwetter]

azul, on 12 December 2017 - 03:51 PM, said:

Hate to be pedantic but 190 (if that what is was) is nearer a third than half and you are assuming they don't all go

No need to apologise. Most of your replies to me veer on the pedantic anyway!

Just an assumption on my part that 80 year olds might find it harder to get to matches than younger folk. For all the obvious reasons.

[moondog]

I've just looked through my messages and can confirm on 4th September there were 190 over 80 season ticket holders, 63 of which didn't turn up for the previous home game v Coventry, where 570 in total didn't show

[jr1cfc]

azul, on 11 December 2017 - 10:20 PM, said:

That is all that really matters. On the other hand if I was running the club I'd be interested in why 500/600 paid customers aren't turning

Don't we offer free season tickets to the over 90s maybe people got one for their elderly relations wether they go or not

[Tora Tora Tora]

moondog, on 12 December 2017 - 04:23 PM, said:

I've just looked through my messages and can confirm on 4th September there were 190 over 80 season ticket holders, 63 of which didn't turn up for the previous home game v Coventry, where 570 in total didn't show

For someone who spends so much of your own time facilitating answers for many topics on here. You don't sometimes get the credit you deserve.

[60s 70s Spireite]

I should think holidays away account for a fair few 'no shows' of season ticket holders. I know die hards will work their vacations around the fixture list, but I wouldn't think that's the majority. The average worker will have five weeks holiday, so in theory that's five weeks they might not be around, i.e. 10% of weeks in a year. Retirees could, in theory, be away more. And there's a lot of grey hair in the West Stand!
Not saying it explains the 500 or so non attendees, but it's another contributory factor.

[dim view]

60s 70s Spireite, on 12 December 2017 - 05:15 PM, said:

I should think holidays away account for a fair few 'no shows' of season ticket holders. I know die hards will work their vacations around the fixture list, but I wouldn't think that's the majority. The average worker will have five weeks holiday, so in theory that's five weeks they might not be around, i.e. 10% of weeks in a year. Retirees could, in theory, be away more. And there's a lot of grey hair in the West Stand!
Not saying it explains the 500 or so non attendees, but it's another contributory factor.

What it all boils down to is whether we give a monkeys what Ashley reports. I personally do because I find it hard to reconcile declared attendances over 5k with Ashley saying that Allen wants to sell because he keeps putting money in that he doesn't get back. If Ashley's budget is 5k why is Allen haemorraging cash?

[Nivo]

dim view, on 12 December 2017 - 05:25 PM, said:

What it all boils down to is whether we give a monkeys what Ashley reports. I personally do because I find it hard to reconcile declared attendances over 5k with Ashley saying that Allen wants to sell because he keeps putting money in that he doesn't get back. If Ashley's budget is 5k why is Allen haemorraging cash?

1) We may well be getting gates of 5,000, but how many of these tickets are either heavily discounted or free of charge as part of a school promotion or similar?

2) Income could, and will be down in other areas of the business (sponsorship, lounge membership, conference and banqueting) which will throw out Mr. Carson's 5,000 budgeted attendance to break-even.

[dim view]

Nivo, on 12 December 2017 - 05:35 PM, said:

1) We may well be getting gates of 5,000, but how many of these tickets are either heavily discounted or free of charge as part of a school promotion or similar?

2) Income could, and will be down in other areas of the business (sponsorship, lounge membership, conference and banqueting) which will throw out Mr. Carson's 5,000 budgeted attendance to break-even.

That's the gist of my post number 44.
Ashley should be using gate figures to demonstrate a shortfall which would endorse Allen's statement, not try to mask it.

[Snowflake McBedwetter]

moondog, on 12 December 2017 - 04:23 PM, said:

I've just looked through my messages and can confirm on 4th September there were 190 over 80 season ticket holders, 63 of which didn't turn up for the previous home game v Coventry, where 570 in total didn't show

Cheers for the stats.

I thought somebody said the general rule was about 1/5 to 1/6 non-attendance of ST holders. Slighter higher for over 80s.

[moondog]

dim view, on 11 December 2017 - 09:19 AM, said:

For me, it's whether the gates fall within Ashley's budgetary estimates. He declared pre-season that he needs a 5k break even figure. Did he achieve that on Saturday, yes or no?, is what I would like to know.

AC confirms the budget was based on gates of 5,000 but the reality is around 4,000 when you consider quite a few attendees have been on offers via the community trust

[dim view]

moondog, on 13 December 2017 - 09:15 PM, said:

AC confirms the budget was based on gates of 5,000 but the reality is around 4,000 when you consider quite a few attendees have been on offers via the community trust

thanks for the response.

Perhaps Ashley should have another go at declaring what his break even attendance needs to be, taking into account offers. He seems to be saying that the 5k was based on errrrr..........no thought.

[Westbars Spireite]

dim view, on 13 December 2017 - 09:19 PM, said:

thanks for the response.

Perhaps Ashley should have another go at declaring what his break even attendance needs to be, taking into account offers. He seems to be saying that the 5k was based on errrrr..........no thought.

The numbers are irrelevant. It's the actual receipts that matter.

[dim view]

Westbars Spireite, on 13 December 2017 - 09:26 PM, said:

The numbers are irrelevant. It's the actual receipts that matter.

He said he'd based his working budget on 5k home gates. Empty words?

[Westbars Spireite]

dim view, on 13 December 2017 - 09:37 PM, said:

He said he'd based his working budget on 5k home gates. Empty words?

Knowing they'd do what they could (and rightly so) to boost numbers with freebies and offers that bring down the average spend it means little.

The actual target internally should have been a cash amount per home game across all income streams.

[azul]

dim view, on 13 December 2017 - 09:37 PM, said:

He said he'd based his working budget on 5k home gates. Empty words?

Hopefully he wasn't planning for us to be at the bottom. In and around the playoffs we probably be getting 5000 or more without the freebies

[dim view]

Westbars Spireite, on 13 December 2017 - 09:41 PM, said:

Knowing they'd do what they could (and rightly so) to boost numbers with freebies and offers that bring down the average spend it means little.

The actual target internally should have been a cash amount per home game across all income streams.

He knows that the fans would like to be given a crowd figure which broadly equates to us breaking even. All fans like to know it, at every club, every year. It would be nice if some effort could be put into the calculation. Maybe he could revise it for a half season?

[CFC91]

Hospitality always looks really empty this season too on the highlights in the West Stand. Guessing that will be behind target.

[gb007]

CFC91, on 14 December 2017 - 10:37 AM, said:

Hospitality always looks really empty this season too on the highlights in the West Stand. Guessing that will be behind target.

At £70 a ticket for meal and lounge access its always going to be a struggle to fill it (big games aside).
I paid an additional £42 for a Barnet ticket for the 1866 lounge-no hospitality !!

These sort of prices are hardly going to attract the 'floating fan'

[JonB]

I've done hospitality a few times, the last being a few years back now, and it was always very good. Excellent food, drinks and good seats. Think we paid £60 at the most but cant be sure. It wasnt always the easiest to get in being sold out all the time when being held in the smaller of the lounges back then. Not been since it was moved into the bigger one. I suspect like the decrease in sales of normal tickets in the end its come down to what has been on offer on the field as much as anything else. When we were doing well generally more folk will turn up be it on the Kop, West Stand or paying more for hospitality.