bman, on 12 October 2014 - 12:00 PM, said:
It's clearly not as bad as in the Balkans and anyone who thinks that is insane. However, it's all on the same spectrum and will lead to no good. Bringing it back to the UK, it's interesting to note how the rise of UKIP has coincided with the implosion of the BNP - the BNP is at the more extreme end of that scale, but UKIP gives a more credible and respectable outlet for some people who may have flirted with the BNP but couldn't bring themselves to vote that way. I think that withdrawing from the EU would be socially, economically and politically disastrous. Especially if it's a withdrawal motivated by the views of people like Monsieur Farage. What I mean by that is that standing alone may or may not be a bad thing (everyone will have their own views - you can guess mine) but his motivations for withdrawal are so that we give up protections on workers' rights (social disaster), make it harder to trade (economic disaster) and lose influence in the world (political disaster). He's more of a Tory than Thatcher.
So, by extension, as his nationalism isn't anywhere near that of the Balkans, almost a distant universe its so far away - its hardly dangerous is it? I will tell you what IS dangerous though - Ignoring the legitimate concerns of "masses", and branding any debate on uncontrolled mass migration as racism. That really is dangerous, and breeds resentment and extremism. That forces people to the edge, and towards groups like "Britain first" and the "EDL"......because the main political elite refuse to have a sensible debate about it.The BNP would never ever have anywhere near the type of support from ordinary men and women from all sides of the political spectrum. Its utterly ridiculous to suggest it. Lazy political correct "brand them racist to undermine them" nonsense. I thought you had a much better debating style - you disappoint me with that.
He may be more of a tory than thatcher, but that isn't the point. If he makes in roads into both Labour and Tory support as a "one policy" party then clearly the main 2 will have to change their policies to meet the threat. for me, UKIP is a vehicle for change, and that change is to leave an un elected political organisation that represents no one but its own political existence and rules by decree.
Norway, Iceland, Switzerland among others have close economic ties with the EU, but not so close political ties and govern themselves. They have a 0.5% import/export duty with the EU (which is effectively a free trade agreement) and are doing fine. That is where I want the UK to be.
Are you really suggesting that a company like BMW or Audi wouldn't trade with the UK because we left the EU, or that our expertise in specialist manufacturing (Rolls Royce Aero Engines for example) would suffer? Would we stop selling goods and services to the EU because we were not politically joined with them? Trade isn't driven by political nonsense from un elected commissions
Look at the Eurozone now. Southern Europe is in a mess, its a basket case in Greece. Italy is Struggling. Portugal is struggling. France isn't doing well, and now Germany is having a slowdown for second quarter. One size fitas all central economic *ahem* "planning" hasn't worked, and it was obvious it wouldn't 10 years ago. .
This post has been edited by a kick in the balls: 12 October 2014 - 01:32 PM
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