Bob's Board - Chesterfield FC: Do We Really Want To Be Associated With This Questionable Enterprise. - Bob's Board - Chesterfield FC

Zorro, on 24 August 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

1) AC is neither a director or shareholder of either CFC Football Development School or CFC International Football Academy, why therefore did he feel the need to inject £30K? At what point does he expect to be repaid?

2) CT resigned as a director of both the businesses mentioned in point 1 at the end of May. It appears odd that he's pulled away from the businesses yet subsequently chose to stick in £30K Again, at what point does he expect to be repaid?

3) With regards to the source of the funding, someone had best brief Liam Sutcliffe......

Thanks Zorro,

Although am curious about what is redacted in the *****s i understand your caution.

For me what is interesting/frustrating, is even with all of that 'cleared up' we are back to the questions we had right at the start, which was simply, was the academy getting a deal or extra subsidies from the club. (some of this you answered above, but:)
For example, if the PPP/ academy/ whatever it is across the road is nothing to do with the club then do they pay the going rate for all of the CFC Branding that they use? Do they pay for pitch hire when they play/ train at the club or it's training grounds? Do they pay for matchday tickets? as you always see a group of lads in kit head back across sheff road after games.
If another local team wanted to use the badge/facilities/ get tickets for the game would it cost them more?
If the academy was part of the club, that would be absolutely fine, but we're told it isn't.

freelander2, on 24 August 2016 - 02:06 PM, said:

Mike, I didn't say AC was a director or shareholder, I was merely posting what I was informed.

There were many parents & employers owed money by the PPP, we know that they had also lost over £70k in the financial year. In the light of what was owed and the way it was reflecting that the PPP was part of CFC, do you think the club needed more bad publicity? Maybe, just maybe CT knew that there was something in the pipeline in the future for the PPP, maybe he asked AC to put a cash injection in for a short term loan to please the parents & employers. I don't know those answers but I can't go down the route of making accusations into why they loaned their personal money into the PPP.

I can't understand why CT chose only to resign in May from the second directorship. He and others had previously told me that he had resigned before, which I think he thought he had done when he resigned from the first directorship.

Rob

Zorro, on 24 August 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

1. Why would AC invest thirty thousand pounds into an enterprise which had attracted so many negative reports, seen a plethora of employees leave - resulting in the Leeds branch closing, lost nearly eighty thousand pounds, embraced a character like Bingham, and against which a CCJ had been awarded and had experienced at least one visit from a court appointed officer? Shouldn't any 'investigation, like the one you and he clearly believed necessary, been conducted prior to him injecting money? Then doesn't joining the CEO in 'having a vested interest', as you put it, raise more rather than quelling questions over those interests coming into conflict?

2. Why did it take so long, so many innocent people being left out of pocket and so many scandals for Turner and Carson to allegedly address PPP's finances?

3. Doesn't the fact unknown creditors came forward after failing to appear on the 'register' you refer to speak of exactly the sort of amateurism PPP has become renown for? And again, is this really the sort of business into which someone would inject tens of thousands?

4. Why has Turner resigned from an enterprise to which he's just supposedly loaned significant funds?

5. Have you or anyone else received the apologies of which you spoke?

6. AC seems to say it was the Chairman's decision to render the DT 'unwelcome'; but doesn't that contradict Turner's recent claim it was 'never really banned'? Besides, exactly how often does Dave Allen read the DT? And why ban their reporters rather than conduct an enquiry into what was written if he does read it? Why no legal challenge - similar to the ones pursued against folk on social media - if it's reports were wrong?

7. Can you put a date to'As of this morning, I've been told that there are no monies outstanding to any persons from the PPP (other than CT & AC)?

8. I'd suggest the 'PPP has no connections to CFC' assertion was rendered pretty much invalid when it adopted the CFC title, brand, badge and filmed promotional videos at the Proact. Didn't Turner and Sutcliffe's enterprise also use the CFC address for a period, too? Meanwhile fans are still wondering how much it's paid for use of the pitch and other facilities.

Rob.

I'm more than a little disappointed you chose to post only part of a conversation that could possibly prove extremely revealing if reproduced in it's entirety. If CT and AC are as believable and transparent as you've stated why not repeat the full exchange?

This is in no way intended as a criticism of you - indeed we've discussed these issues in a friendly manner face-to-face - but I just feel the entire fanbase deserve to know the truth.

Am I alone in thinking that this thread continues to go around in circles? The issues are all well known and the mistakes that have been made have been acknowledged. Unless certain posters practice what they preach in terms of starting off with a clean slate, rebuilding trust between the fans and the Board, then we will get nowhere. Continually repeating previous events to score points will in itself prevent the healing process that we all want.

MDCCCLXVI, on 24 August 2016 - 06:32 PM, said:

the antics of our senior management become more absurd by the day

This post has been edited by dim view: 24 August 2016 - 07:44 PM

Chris, I find your comment about not posting the entire thread as unfair. You know the points that are missing and I wouldn't like to be the one where I could leave myself open towards a legal backlash.

Sooner or later we have to end going over the same ground. I have been in touch with AC regarding my post and subsequent further questions that Denny raised.

If you, I or others think there are any legal issues, then I suggest advice should be sought from a lawyer and it should go through the correct procedures.

Personally I still think that another meeting should be held with a few fans and CFC officials. Not just turning up with questions but for us to give them an in depth agenda of items that supporters need to raise and for us to receive answers.

We then have to accept what we are told or disprove their answers.

As Freddie says, we are going round in circles with no conclusions in sight.

I have just received a message from AC allowing me to post replies to certain questions and I will post shortly.

Rob

Freddie, on 24 August 2016 - 07:00 PM, said:

If the thread in any way 'goes 'round in circles' - which given the various scandals exposed and resignation/sacking witnessed clearly hasn't - it's because so many of the statements made by those in focus appear contradictory.

Such as those featured above, for example.

Far from 'scoring points', issues are continually repeated because they've yet to be legitimately addressed.

Freddie, on 24 August 2016 - 07:00 PM, said:

Absolute nail on the head.. Some people's posts are like Groundhog Day... They want people to post things that they daren't post themselves!

Bob
I will try to answer, they may not be the answers that the members like, but I will be honest and probably leave myself wide open.

View PostZorro, on 24 August 2016 - 01:53 PM, said:
AC has a vested interest in the PPP now as he has thrown approximately £30,000 in to it along with another £30,000 that CT threw in to cover the repayments to the parents and anyone else who was owed money.


1) AC is neither a director or shareholder of either CFC Football Development School or CFC International Football Academy, why therefore did he feel the need to inject £30K? At what point does he expect to be repaid?
I was asked by Liam and CT if I would help. At the time the rooms were empty and no monies were coming in. He admitted that his clerical skills and admin was a problem due to lack of staff. He admitted that he was in debt, not taken a wage himself for 3 months.

I paid the back rent for the Village. A following meeting and a review of his accounts revealed lots of outstanding bills and parents not been paid back on trips. The total I have loaned Liam on personal loan, interest free now stands at £34,000.

Since then CT has loaned a further £25,000 on the same conditions. This we think has sorted all outstanding liabilities.

Why do it? Irrespective of being slagged off for being a Dee Dah, I actually care about the club and have done this because I honestly believe it will come good and CFC will benefit from new players. I also believe in Liam. The only thing he has done wrong is burry his head in the sand when the money ran out. He is a good coach and great at attracting players from all over the world.

2) CT resigned as a director of both the businesses mentioned in point 1 at the end of May. It appears odd that he's pulled away from the businesses yet subsequently chose to stick in £30K Again, at what point does he expect to be repaid?

He has loaned Liam £25,000 with the same conditions as me. It was thought best that having helped set up the company that he now step aside. All the association has been carried out with the CFC Board approval, there has been nothing underhand.

3) With regards to the source of the funding, someone had best brief Liam Sutcliffe......
Don't understand this statement

Ashley

Bob
The PPP / Village is a totally separate company and yet again I will confirm that they receive no financial subsidy what so ever from CFC. There is no money paid over to help or support them.


For example, if the PPP/ academy/ whatever it is across the road is nothing to do with the club then do they pay the going rate for all of the CFC Branding that they use? They currently do not pay anything for using our badge. It is deemed a marketing tool and for now we do not make a charge. What would the point be in doing this when they currently are cash strapped ?

Do they pay for pitch hire when they play/ train at the club or it's training grounds? They do not use CFC facilities.mthey train at Gosforth and I haven't a clue what they pay, but we don't pay for this.

Do they pay for matchday tickets? as you always see a group of lads in kit head back across sheff road after games. NO . This is a goodwill gesture, once again hoping to invest to gain benefits in the future.

They also kick about on the field behind the Village at no cost.


If another local team wanted to use the badge/facilities/ get tickets for the game would it cost them more? We have not received any proposals, CFC is always open to talking and investigating this.
If the academy was part of the club, that would be absolutely fine, but we're told it isn't. Correct it isn't.


The Village has today been holding trials and 25 players have turned up. It looks like 3 have been retained further trials. They have travelled from all over the country and from overseas.

It only needs one of these to be a success, and CFC have first option.

For goodness sake please stop slagging them off and give them a chance. The club will not support this forever if it does not work out, but for now we are backing it 100%.

I would suggest maybe an open evening for some of you to visit the Village and see for yourselves. I was very impressed.

AshleyC

Ashley, what kind of backing are you giving them? Keeping your loans to 1 side

Bob

Sent Today, 08:17 PM
Bob,
Liam was supporting CFC with education, child welfare, scouting, scholars and trialists for CFC have been put up in his digs free of charge over the last 2 years.

Since Bobs Boards constant attacking he is considering withdrawing this support. That would cost us an additional £40,000 per annum


This is a 2 way street

Sent Today, 08:18 PM
Bob, nothing at all, apart from a little advice and guidance



Sent Today, 08:22 PM
Bob,

I would like to set up An open evening at the PPP.

Cost £10 per person.

Tour of the Village
Presentation at the club
Questions and Answers with Liam, Chris and I

Pie and Peas and a Pint all included

Date to be arranged if the numbers stack up, say limits to 25 ???

Ashley'C

I am prepared to sort an open evening for Bobs Board members and Derbyshire Times can attend on the house.

Tour of the Village
Presentation by Liam
Question and Asnwers by Liam, CT and Myself

Pie and Peas, Pint of Beer

All for £10 per person

Limit to 25 persons, Date to be arranged

Any takers ??
AshleyC

Sorry thought PM , I didn't mean to post directly.......

Statement from Chris Turner and Ashkey Carson

We have both put money into this company for no personal gain and all to lose. Who ever you are, this is a lot of money and has caudate both us of problems in our own lives.

But we both believe in the objectives and the business model.

Liam has basically been left so paddle his own canoe for so long and is so kinking. We wanted to help.

The end game is always to ben fit Chesterfield FC. You all slag us off, but we are maybe not going with a true business decision, but with our hearts on this.

Chesterfield FC I hope will gain in the future, as for CT and I, we either get our money back or lose the lot. !!!

For now the Business is looking a lot brighter now than 3 months ago. I talk to the bank (Barclays) and although I have. I access to their accounts they are very happy with the accounts.

I really hope you can stop going round in circles and support Liam.

Please take CT and I up on our offer of an open evening

AshleyC

Zorro, on 24 August 2016 - 07:30 PM, said:

Rob.

Yes we're both aware of what's edited and why you did so, but I find it 'unfair' to post that AC and CT were 'frank', 'open', and you had 'no doubts believing' whilst large tracts of your conversation remain redacted.

Meanwhile there're many perceived contradictions such as those covered above.

If AC really does want to engender an atmosphere of transparency, as mentioned by the CEO in a recent interview, then all he has to do is agree to everything he admitted being revealed.

Otherwise the more cynical and suspicious might think you're being used to pass on only the more PR beneficial aspects of your exchange.

acarson, on 24 August 2016 - 07:49 PM, said:

If the money goes to charity I'll make one

acarson, on 24 August 2016 - 07:58 PM, said:

I'm guessing this has been hastily written on an unsympathetic appliance, hence the poor spelling and grammar.

I'm sure folk will understand that, Ashley.

A few of things, though.

You appeal to us to 'support Liam'; but how 'supportive' has his fellow director been in resigning?

Does he enjoy your full 'support' despite overseeing huge debts, a CCJ and bailiff visit, an association with Dennis Bingham, a mass exodus of allegedly unpaid staff and cancelled trips with parents remaining unpaid? All just the result of 'head burying'? And what was his fellow director doing all this time?

What sort of business plan was in place for the enterprise to fail so badly?

How has that business plan changed?

Most of all, won't anything said simply be one person's word against another unless there's access to the books?

I'd appreciate an answer on here rather than being charged a tenner.

Oh, and PS: will you allow Rob to post your full exchange involving allegations regarding PPP without the threat of legal action?

This post has been edited by MDCCCLXVI: 24 August 2016 - 08:43 PM

MDCCCLXVI, on 24 August 2016 - 08:32 PM, said:

Spin dryer with an unbalanced load?

A tenner a man? Not sure what to make of the idea of charging people for this.

Westbars Spireite, on 24 August 2016 - 08:36 PM, said:

Canned up i assume after reading all that.

Westbars Spireite, on 24 August 2016 - 08:36 PM, said:

The club is in debt man, it can't go about giving out free pie and peas!