[Valley Blues]

The Silva ‘handball’ was nothing of the sort. A complete deflection to a player on the move at pace.

The TAA ‘handball’ , IMO, was not handball but how on earth was it not given?

When you consider how closely decisions have been scrutinised, to the extent that a rogue pubic hair can be in an offside position, that was a clear handball preventing the ball moving to a City player on the back post.

The whole VAR system is a joke.

[Fit as a Nelson]

Valley Blues, on 10 November 2019 - 06:42 PM, said:

The Silva ‘handball’ was nothing of the sort. A complete deflection to a player on the move at pace.

The TAA ‘handball’ , IMO, was not handball but how on earth was it not given?

When you consider how closely decisions have been scrutinised, to the extent that a rogue pubic hair can be in an offside position, that was a clear handball preventing the ball moving to a City player on the back post.

The whole VAR system is a joke.

As you say if TAA doesn’t touch it Sterling is tapping that in at the back post. Bin VAR, asap. Nobody ever talks about the football anymore, just VAR spoiling games!

[JonB]

Former ref Bobby Madley tweeted had it gone to VAR then it would have been handball against silva so free kick to Liverpool which was prior to the penalty appeal. Thing is that whole passage of play is why VAR is difficult in a free flowing game like football. Had the ref taken the give a pen then see what VAR says approach and it’s overturned it’s stopped the passage of play where Liverpool score. Completely changes the game.

In terms of handball the rules are different for attacking compared to defending. I think it’s any handball in terms of attacking but they make allowances when defending for ones like the one later in the game where Sterling whacked it at TAA from a yard away and it caught his arm.

[firedodger]

I had the pleasure of going to the Tottenham game on Saturday, football authorities just need to sample the stadium frustrations when they are fannying about with VAR to know how supporters feel, they briefly flashed the image onto the big screens and people were no better informed. All the spurs fans round me couldn’t understand why it wasn’t a goal, and would have been quite happy if the goal had been given because the image doesn’t clear it up, he’s level.
One bloke made an interesting prediction, he said it won’t be long before the VAR pause becomes and advertising opportunity and I reckon he’s probably right.
The Liverpool handball? Well it was wasn’t it, all this stuff about unnatural arms position and does the position of the arm make the defender bigger, it’s just complicating the game and making decisions harder to make and accept.
I enjoyed the rugby recently but find myself scratching my head and not understanding many of the stupid complicated rules, football is in danger of going down the same path.

[JonB]

firedodger, on 11 November 2019 - 12:58 PM, said:

The Liverpool handball? Well it was wasn’t it, all this stuff about unnatural arms position and does the position of the arm make the defender bigger, it’s just complicating the game and making decisions harder to make and accept.

Even if you say TAA handballed it then it was handball by Silva first so still wasnt a penalty....

[Siberian Spireite]

Drives me mad when defenders put their arms behind their backs now, but such is the stupid opacity of the handball rule nowadays. Dover v Southend yesterday, for the winning goal, the Southend defender just stood there, arms behind his back, unable to balance or move to block the attacker, as the Dover lad merrily ran in to smash home his shot.

[Search & Destroy]

Fit as a Nelson, on 10 November 2019 - 06:47 PM, said:

As you say if TAA doesn’t touch it Sterling is tapping that in at the back post. Bin VAR, asap. Nobody ever talks about the football anymore, just VAR spoiling games!

Ref probably realised that Sterlers would have missed anyway

[BurySpireite]

People who've been watching football for longer than me, what happened in the past with handballs and pens then, was any hit of the hand given or were they more lenient depending on intent?

Just seems both harsh to penalise unintetional handballs with penalties and harsh on the attacking team not to if the ball was running through to their attacker.

[JonB]

BurySpireite, on 11 November 2019 - 02:56 PM, said:

People who've been watching football for longer than me, what happened in the past with handballs and pens then, was any hit of the hand given or were they more lenient depending on intent?

Just seems both harsh to penalise unintetional handballs with penalties and harsh on the attacking team not to if the ball was running through to their attacker.

I remember Darren Deadman giving a penalty against Janos Kovacs for handball and i think sending him off for it when Freddie Eastwood smashed it at him from about 3yds away and it hit him in the chest just inside the 18yd box!

[azul]

BurySpireite, on 11 November 2019 - 02:56 PM, said:

People who've been watching football for longer than me, what happened in the past with handballs and pens then, was any hit of the hand given or were they more lenient depending on intent?

Just seems both harsh to penalise unintetional handballs with penalties and harsh on the attacking team not to if the ball was running through to their attacker.

About the only rule I remember was that it had to be deemed deliberate and that still remains the first rule as far as I’m aware.

They've refined the rules recently to take into account whether the hand has increased the players profile.(i.e. is it sticking out). I guess it was an attempt to clarify the unwritten rule referees often adopted.

The bottom line it is handball was always subjective and it remains so even with VAR.

JonB, on 11 November 2019 - 03:13 PM, said:

I remember Darren Deadman giving a penalty against Janos Kovacs for handball and i think sending him off for it when Freddie Eastwood smashed it at him from about 3yds away and it hit him in the chest just inside the 18yd box!

Darren Deadman always implemented his own set of rules - that’s why he was always so well loved

[clarevoyant.]

JonB, on 11 November 2019 - 03:13 PM, said:

I remember Darren Deadman giving a penalty against Janos Kovacs for handball and i think sending him off for it when Freddie Eastwood smashed it at him from about 3yds away and it hit him in the chest just inside the 18yd box!

Didn't Janos leave the field with a bloodied nose which should have given the ever unastute Deadman a clue as to the point of impact.

This post has been edited by clarevoyant.: 12 November 2019 - 09:21 AM

[JonB]

clarevoyant., on 12 November 2019 - 09:14 AM, said:

Didn't Janos leave the field with a bloodied nose which should have given the ever unastute Deadman a clue as to the point of impact.

Cant remember the exact details just the penalty incident that made it 1-1, then Caleb Folan who was just starting to find that form that eventually led to him being sold the following season came on and was involved in both our goals to put us 3-2 up from 2-1 down before we ended up losing 4-3 and Freddie Eastwood got a hat trick. We actually played really well with 10 men and i just remember the decision being completely awful but Deadman refused to overturn the decision when we appealed. In fact it may be the one where it was extended for having the cheek to appeal it!!

[bifocart]

BurySpireite, on 11 November 2019 - 02:56 PM, said:

People who've been watching football for longer than me, what happened in the past with handballs and pens then, was any hit of the hand given or were they more lenient depending on intent?

Just seems both harsh to penalise unintetional handballs with penalties and harsh on the attacking team not to if the ball was running through to their attacker.

One of the things that kept us all sane after blatantly incorrect decisions was a gradual acceptance that these things evened out over time. It was probably useful in that it discouraged a binary view of things and encouraged an understanding and appreciation of grey areas, human error, and the comparative unimportance of sport. Except in the case of Elleray of course. No-one is that reasonable.

Nothing happens in football unless someone can make money from it. The bloke mentioned elsewhere who predicts the VAR interval becoming an advert break is probably right. The anger generated by VAR is already being monetised by the gormless likes of Savage and Sutton who thrive on stoking and prodding the "passion" or rampant blood pressure of the already volatile.

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

JonB, on 11 November 2019 - 02:12 PM, said:

Even if you say TAA handballed it then it was handball by Silva first so still wasnt a penalty....

Liverpool have got to win the league somehow so they are getting a helping hand with some of the decisions. God help us if they ever go against Klop

[JonB]

Flip side they were on the wrong end of it when Firmino’s armpit was classed offside.

[firedodger]

Even if you say TAA handballed it then it was handball by Silva first so still wasnt a penalty....


Sadly that’s up to the officials to decide, something they seem incapable of doing correctly even with the help of video footage. I ha ent seen any freeze frames of the salah offside incident so don’t really know about that, I’m just amazed he stayed on his feet.

[SpireiteFitzy]

Liverpool getting helped by VAR yet again, awful decision. Someone's paying them handsomely.

[spireitetoo]

They do seem to be getting the decisions in their favour, as do spurs, where as man city only seem to be getting them against em..
Merson even commented similar on soccer satdi

[JonB]

Weren’t Liverpool denied a goal against villa because of someone’s armpit being offside?! Think it’s just crap all round to be honest!!

[HoneyTrippa]

Good Job that didn't have VAR at Harrogate yesterday it could have been 6-1 to Harrogate ( two potential handballs and a definite foul for Harrogate) which the ref missed.