[The Black Triangle]

whittman, on 17 October 2016 - 04:22 PM, said:

If I remember rightly Cook cut that interview short with something along the lines of "I am going before I say
something I might regret" and I genuinely thought he was about to resign at that time given the tone of his voice

Anyone got a link to this, I might be getting a few different things confused here.

[Guest_freelander2_*]

The Gimp, on 17 October 2016 - 08:52 PM, said:

As early as that? We'll blow me down. So when did the finances really start to get out of control, it can't have been as early as that can it? So something other than Turners involvement must be a contributing factor to then. Did DA unleash spending backing Cook, because in 2011 Sheridan was here, and Turner is simply the scapegoat/frontman then?
You have surprised me with that.

Y/E 06/11 - Turnover £5.8M, net loss £22,377

CT Appointed Dec 11.

BH retired Apr 12.

Y/E 06/12 - Turnover £6.3M, net profit £80,559

Y/E 06/13 - Turnover £5.4M, net loss £438,459

Y/E 06/14 - Turnover £6.3M, net loss £1,063,818

Y/E 06/15 - Turnover £7.3M, net profit £84,879

[ELTON 2020]

freelander2, on 17 October 2016 - 09:03 PM, said:

Y/E 06/11 - Turnover £5.8M, net loss £22,377

CT Appointed Dec 11.

BH retired Apr 12.

Y/E 06/12 - Turnover £6.3M, net profit £80,559

Y/E 06/13 - Turnover £5.4M, net loss £438,459

Y/E 06/14 - Turnover £6.3M, net loss £1,063,818

Y/E 06/15 - Turnover £7.3M, net profit £84,879

[Guest_freelander2_*]

The Gimp, on 17 October 2016 - 08:55 PM, said:

Anyone got a link to this, I might be getting a few different things confused here.

http://www.player.ch...oln&season=2014

[The Black Triangle]

freelander2, on 17 October 2016 - 09:03 PM, said:

Y/E 06/11 - Turnover £5.8M, net loss £22,377

CT Appointed Dec 11.

BH retired Apr 12.

Y/E 06/12 - Turnover £6.3M, net profit £80,559

Y/E 06/13 - Turnover £5.4M, net loss £438,459

Y/E 06/14 - Turnover £6.3M, net loss £1,063,818

Y/E 06/15 - Turnover £7.3M, net profit £84,879

Year 2012 small profit.
Year 2013 loss - I guess is to be expected given income dropping.
Year 2014 income similar to 2012 but balance differential of over £1,100,000! WTF! WTF!

Wow. Cooks first full year. WTF happened in that year!

[Tha Knows...]

h again, on 17 October 2016 - 08:01 PM, said:

It would be nice if you could abandon the politician-speak about 'the good folk of North Derbyshire'. The folk of North Derbyshire are no different to the folk of anywhere else, being a mixture of good, bad and indifferent, and it's only smarmy gits in politics who're trying to butter them up for votes who pretend differently.
And, as if it needed pointing out, these entirely normal people didn't fancy CFC enough to turn out in sufficient numbers to maintain Championship football, even when we'd just got promoted and were playing like a Championship side. We doubled the gates of the Saltergate era, which was a splendid effort, but there's always an upper limit and we'd reached it.
Why you have a problem with that baffles me, but DA's financial involvement concentrated his mind, as you'd expect, and he decided to pull the plug on big spending. Whether he tries again when the dust from the present crisis settles we shall have to see - it's not beyond the realms of possibility, but unlikely.

This view pretty much says we couldn't hope to attract a similar number of home fans as Rotherham if we had the same success which imo is illogical.

[The Black Triangle]

freelander2, on 17 October 2016 - 09:20 PM, said:

http://www.player.ch...oln&season=2014

With hindsight, what a telling interview that was. Where did it all go so wrong?

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

h again, on 17 October 2016 - 08:01 PM, said:

It would be nice if you could abandon the politician-speak about 'the good folk of North Derbyshire'. The folk of North Derbyshire are no different to the folk of anywhere else, being a mixture of good, bad and indifferent, and it's only smarmy gits in politics who're trying to butter them up for votes who pretend differently.
And, as if it needed pointing out, these entirely normal people didn't fancy CFC enough to turn out in sufficient numbers to maintain Championship football, even when we'd just got promoted and were playing like a Championship side. We doubled the gates of the Saltergate era, which was a splendid effort, but there's always an upper limit and we'd reached it.
Why you have a problem with that baffles me, but DA's financial involvement concentrated his mind, as you'd expect, and he decided to pull the plug on big spending. Whether he tries again when the dust from the present crisis settles we shall have to see - it's not beyond the realms of possibility, but unlikely.

So the bloke who 'only wants to talk about football' spends a whole paragraph sniping at a friendly figure of speech, a second making fatuous assertions (how can we possibly know what our 'upper limit' really is? Exactly what is this mythical figure needed to 'maintain Championship football'? And what about Yeovil? Or Burton? Or Scunthorpe and Bury currently challenging?), then returns to the same apologistic posturing that's seen him spend months in humiliated - some might say cowardly and cynical - silence.

In reality the timeline couldn't be clearer: the very public pursuit of Higdon came to an abrupt end almost immediately the huge loss you conveniently choose to ignore was announced (in the same way you've nowt to say on the PPP scandals, 'Rafflegate', 'Erniegate', sackings, resignations, etc, etc, etc...).

Then Cook's downbeat pre-season demeanour proved appropriate when no further signings arrived until Cooper was sold.

Next, instead of insisting not only the Club's but the country's leading scorer honour the contract he'd signed only months earlier - as recently happened in the case of Ariyibi, Doyle was touted and sold amidst despicable allegations he'd somehow forced the deal upon CFC. To be replaced by such high profile recruits as Harrison, of course.

All of which preceded Phil Tooley's 'good as it gets' thread, almost prophetic in it's warning of the mass exodus to come.

Somehow, against all these odds, Cook clawed us into the play offs. And it was then, a week or so after selling out the Proact versus Bristol City, that the visit of Preston you and others blame for Allen's plug pulling took place.

Tell you what, though, why not stick around instead of returning to your anonymous hidey-hole after once more being proven wrong. I mean, it's not too long before the accounts are revealed - and we can all see just how accurate your 'one and a half million off the debt' prediction following the last set really was.

This post has been edited by MDCCCLXVI: 19 October 2016 - 05:28 PM

[Snowflake McBedwetter]

It's ridiculous to only look at what Cook spent. How much did we get back from the recruitment and increased gates during his period in charge?

Equally ridiculous to claim we reached an 'upper limit'. Attendances were on an upward curve, and to assume an 8,400 attendance against Preston was a sign of our 'limit' is madness. It was the first of a two-legger, and was live on Sky.
If DA wanted better attendance he shouldn't have tossed out the family silver and replaced it with Deanosaurus and his team of stinkers.

[h again]

MDCCCLXVI, on 19 October 2016 - 05:22 PM, said:

So the bloke who 'only wants to talk about football' spends a whole paragraph sniping at a friendly figure of speech, a second making fatuous assertions (how can we possibly know what our 'upper limit' really is? Exactly what is this mythical figure needed to 'maintain Championship football'? And what about Yeovil? Or Burton? Or Scunthorpe and Bury currently challenging?), then returns to the same apologistic posturing that's seen him spend months in humiliated - some might say cowardly and cynical - silence.

In reality the timeline couldn't be clearer: the very public pursuit of Higdon came to an abrupt end almost immediately the huge loss you conveniently choose to ignore was announced (in the same way you've nowt to say on the PPP scandals, 'Rafflegate', 'Erniegate', sackings, resignations, etc, etc, etc...).

Then Cook's downbeat pre-season demeanour proved appropriate when no further signings arrived until Cooper was sold.

Next, instead of insisting not only the Club's but the country's leading scorer honour the contract he'd signed only months earlier - as recently happened in the case of Ariyibi, Doyle was touted and sold amidst despicable allegations he'd somehow forced the deal upon CFC. To be replaced by such high profile recruits as Harrison, of course.

All of which preceded Phil Tooley's 'good as it gets' thread, almost prophetic in it's warning of the mass exodus to come.

Somehow, against all these odds, Cook clawed us into the play offs. And it was then, a week or so after selling out the Proact versus Bristol City, that the visit of Preston you and others blame for Allen's plug pulling took place.

Tell you what, though, why not stick around instead of returning to your anonymous hidey-hole after once more being proven wrong. I mean, it's not too long before the accounts are revealed - and we can all see just how accurate your 'one and a half million off the debt' prediction following the last set really was.

All the bluster in the world can't hide the fact that the number of fans who turned up weren't enough to give any hope that we could sustain Championship football. DA looked at the inflated sums we were paying out to the players in wages and bonuses, saw it was ruining the club, realised it was small beer compared to what we'd have to pay in the Championship, and pulled the plug. Sensible bloke, even if it's spoiling our Saturdays.
If you can't appreciate that there's certain level of support needed to match Championship spending then you're a lot more naïve than I think you are. We might guess at the level needed, but it's certainly five figures, and we never even got close. Please don't quote Yeovil and Burton at me - Yeovil are struggling to stay in the league after a catastrophic descent, and Burton will be joining us shortly, but even if you believe that one season of getting hammered in the Championship would be worth having, the man who would have to finance it plainly doesn't, and his is the only opinion that counts.
As for the rest of your output above, it bears no relation to reality whatsoever. Try taking a deep breath and writing in proper paragraphs - it aids reasoned thinking.

[moondog]

h again, on 19 October 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

All the bluster in the world can't hide the fact that the number of fans who turned up weren't enough to give any hope that we could sustain Championship football. DA looked at the inflated sums we were paying out to the players in wages and bonuses, saw it was ruining the club, realised it was small beer compared to what we'd have to pay in the Championship, and pulled the plug. Sensible bloke, even if it's spoiling our Saturdays.
If you can't appreciate that there's certain level of support needed to match Championship spending then you're a lot more naïve than I think you are. We might guess at the level needed, but it's certainly five figures, and we never even got close. Please don't quote Yeovil and Burton at me - Yeovil are struggling to stay in the league after a catastrophic descent, and Burton will be joining us shortly, but even if you believe that one season of getting hammered in the Championship would be worth having, the man who would have to finance it plainly doesn't, and his is the only opinion that counts.
As for the rest of your output above, it bears no relation to reality whatsoever. Try taking a deep breath and writing in proper paragraphs - it aids reasoned thinking.

Rubbish the TV money now for the championship dwarfs gate revenue

[Vivo]

h again, on 19 October 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

All the bluster in the world can't hide the fact that the number of fans who turned up weren't enough to give any hope that we could sustain Championship football. DA looked at the inflated sums we were paying out to the players in wages and bonuses, saw it was ruining the club, realised it was small beer compared to what we'd have to pay in the Championship, and pulled the plug. Sensible bloke, even if it's spoiling our Saturdays.
If you can't appreciate that there's certain level of support needed to match Championship spending then you're a lot more naïve than I think you are. We might guess at the level needed, but it's certainly five figures, and we never even got close. Please don't quote Yeovil and Burton at me - Yeovil are struggling to stay in the league after a catastrophic descent, and Burton will be joining us shortly, but even if you believe that one season of getting hammered in the Championship would be worth having, the man who would have to finance it plainly doesn't, and his is the only opinion that counts.
As for the rest of your output above, it bears no relation to reality whatsoever. Try taking a deep breath and writing in proper paragraphs - it aids reasoned thinking.

Just one quick point to raise from me please. My mate Scunny is a Scunthorpe United die-hard and a very level headed lad (I know about what that suggests). Anyway he always goes on about the isolated location of Scunthorpe and hence the low catchment area for Scunthorpe fans. In their period in the Championship their crowds well very poor on average. He cannot see at all why Chesterfield could not make a go of it in the Championship, especially with the much bigger catchment area for fans that we have. He has a really good point there. So if the bodies are there to fill the seats I think your argument is wrong. Therefore it points to the problem being how the club is being run and the entertainment value that is being provided. Basically both not good enough.

This post has been edited by 70s Vivo: 19 October 2016 - 08:57 PM

[60s 70s Spireite]

moondog, on 19 October 2016 - 08:54 PM, said:

Rubbish the TV money now for the championship dwafts gate revenue

Non parachute clubs receive around £5M 'solidarity' cash from the Premier League and £2M from Sky. Should cover off a still decent wage bill for Burton and leave a tidy profit.

[peakblue]

Bournemouth!!

[60s 70s Spireite]

peakblue, on 19 October 2016 - 09:11 PM, said:

Bournemouth!!

Russian oligarch!!

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

h again, on 19 October 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

All the bluster in the world can't hide the fact that the number of fans who turned up weren't enough to give any hope that we could sustain Championship football. DA looked at the inflated sums we were paying out to the players in wages and bonuses, saw it was ruining the club, realised it was small beer compared to what we'd have to pay in the Championship, and pulled the plug. Sensible bloke, even if it's spoiling our Saturdays.
If you can't appreciate that there's certain level of support needed to match Championship spending then you're a lot more naïve than I think you are. We might guess at the level needed, but it's certainly five figures, and we never even got close. Please don't quote Yeovil and Burton at me - Yeovil are struggling to stay in the league after a catastrophic descent, and Burton will be joining us shortly, but even if you believe that one season of getting hammered in the Championship would be worth having, the man who would have to finance it plainly doesn't, and his is the only opinion that counts.
As for the rest of your output above, it bears no relation to reality whatsoever. Try taking a deep breath and writing in proper paragraphs - it aids reasoned thinking.

So essentially you're ignoring the events to which I referred, repeating opinion as fact (can you reveal details of these 'inflated wages and bonuses' supposedly 'ruining the Club'?), then hoping a few petty snipes will convince folk you've a convincing case. As if trite little jibes like 'your output bears no relation to reality' is credible debate.

Typical pantomime villain stuff. But then at least you've abandoned the brazen hypocrisy of claiming you 'only want to talk about football'.

One thing, though: wasn't it Allen himself who touted second tier football after building only a ten thousand capacity stadium? Where does that leave the plucked-from-thin-air support numbers you've quoted?

I've stated my position, based upon the evidence posted, and I guess this 'bluster' is the best you've got to offer.

As always I'll allow the good people visiting 'Bob's Board' to decide for themselves which is more accurate (did y'see what I did there?).

This post has been edited by MDCCCLXVI: 20 October 2016 - 05:11 PM

[The Black Triangle]

h again, on 19 October 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

All the bluster in the world can't hide the fact that the number of fans who turned up weren't enough to give any hope that we could sustain Championship football. DA looked at the inflated sums we were paying out to the players in wages and bonuses, saw it was ruining the club, realised it was small beer compared to what we'd have to pay in the Championship, and pulled the plug. Sensible bloke, even if it's spoiling our Saturdays.
If you can't appreciate that there's certain level of support needed to match Championship spending then you're a lot more naïve than I think you are. We might guess at the level needed, but it's certainly five figures, and we never even got close. Please don't quote Yeovil and Burton at me - Yeovil are struggling to stay in the league after a catastrophic descent, and Burton will be joining us shortly, but even if you believe that one season of getting hammered in the Championship would be worth having, the man who would have to finance it plainly doesn't, and his is the only opinion that counts.
As for the rest of your output above, it bears no relation to reality whatsoever. Try taking a deep breath and writing in proper paragraphs - it aids reasoned thinking.

"the best hope of paying off the debts is to reach the championship" - Chris Turner. AGM 2015.
When was "sustaining" championship football mentioned by the club, as I don't recall anyone ever saying this. Can you provide a link please?

This post has been edited by The Gimp: 20 October 2016 - 04:24 PM

[peakblue]

I for one recall it being said,and no i don't have link,just a reasonably good memory

[Mr Mercury]

freelander2, on 17 October 2016 - 09:03 PM, said:

Y/E 06/11 - Turnover £5.8M, net loss £22,377

CT Appointed Dec 11.

BH retired Apr 12.

Y/E 06/12 - Turnover £6.3M, net profit £80,559

Y/E 06/13 - Turnover £5.4M, net loss £438,459

Y/E 06/14 - Turnover £6.3M, net loss £1,063,818

Y/E 06/15 - Turnover £7.3M, net profit £84,879

Throw in the figures for his tenure at Hartlepool and it might be a case of pass the razor blades. How the hell is this man still in such an important position?

[moondog]

60s 70s Spireite, on 19 October 2016 - 09:05 PM, said:

Non parachute clubs receive around £5M 'solidarity' cash from the Premier League and £2M from Sky. Should cover off a still decent wage bill for Burton and leave a tidy profit.

The equivalent revenue of getting about 17,000 every home game