[Denny]

I did see graham smyth is pushing for a pulitzer. Having summarised the recent issues and mentioning sutcliffe's lie (his words) on Alan Bigg's show. He did the impossible actually got Biggs to respond.
Three words: "Clearly. Very disappointed"

[Forever a Spireite]

Apology from Carson and Turnipe don't hold your breath!

[Lincs Spireite]

freelander2, on 02 February 2017 - 08:08 PM, said:

Too little, too late.

Understanding the reasons why this subject hasn't been brought to a head before now is the key.

To me the answer is clear, friends helping friends, helping friends.

[Guest_freelander2_*]

Bowzer spirey, on 04 February 2017 - 06:11 AM, said:

To me the answer is clear, friends helping friends, helping friends.

Sadly, I agree.

[moondog]

moondog, on 02 February 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

Correct they called at the club today in relation to non payment of debts relating to Sondico from last season totalling over £8k. They had the Proact Stadium as the address to come to but surprise, surprise the debt was for Sutcliffe's development school. The bailiffs were determined to take away equipment from the club not believing it was a seperate entity until Sutcliffe came over to join CT to prove otherwise.

Once again questions remain about this organisation and its links to CFC that Ashley Carson really does need to sort, He promised a couple of weeks ago he would conduct a independent audit of transactions between the two organisations but this is still awaited.

Here is the aforementioned audit report, it shows at 30/6/16 the club owed the Development Centre £8,595

[Spireite-Karl]

Bowzer spirey, on 04 February 2017 - 06:11 AM, said:

To me the answer is clear, friends helping friends, helping friends.

I'd plus +1 ya, if I had any left.

[Guest_freelander2_*]

moondog, on 04 February 2017 - 06:51 PM, said:

Here is the aforementioned audit report, it shows at 30/6/16 the club owed the Development Centre £8,595

Thank you for working with Ashley Carson & Howard Freeman on this. Our observations directed at AC are as follows:

1) Expenses paid by CFC on behalf of the Development School – Clearly the company owned and managed by Liam Sutcliffe & Chris Turner was unable to obtain lines of credit with their supplier base. Clearly the football club were acting as a lender to their company at a time when Dave Allen was injecting cash into CFC to ensure the club could meet its short term liabilities. Given that during 2014, the club paid £118K of the development school's expenditure, just what percentage of their overall expenditure was that? One imagines a substantial chunk? That being the case, were the club and the development school inextricably linked?


2) Sponsorship Received by CFC on behalf of Development School – During 2015, £15K was deducted off the development school's liability to the club, why would CFC receive sponsorship on behalf of the development school and which sponsor(s) does it relate to? Likewise, does such an arrangement extend to the Community Trust?


3) Rent Charged to CFC by Development School for Village – Again, £24.5K (2015) and £24K (2016) was deducted off the development school's liability to the club. This looks like the club were recharged the entire rental relating to the village, why? Also, please refer to the answer which you gave to question 7 in the list submitted to you prior to the fans' forum on the 9th November where you were asked about this. To remind you:


7) Rent has been charged to the P&L account at £24,500 (2015) and £29,139 (2016). Please confirm if any of the expenditure charged to 'Rent' relates to the accommodation block situated at the front of Simply Gym, Sheffield Road, Chesterfield, known as the 'CFCVillage'?

No. This relates to rent for Pitches / Players Digs. Absolutely no connection with CFC Village

Given that the CFC Village opened during the middle of 2013, who took the decision to recharge the rent to the club for years 2015 & 2016 and more importantly, why?


4) Kit//Pitch Rent/Training – Which totals £9K for 2016. Given what the ex members of staff have told us which you have been made aware of, we believe this requires further investigation.


5) CFC owes Development School – A number of charges have been made to the club covering accommodation, kit, pitch rental and training but these were only introduced during 2015 & 2016. Given that the development school was incorporated late 2012, it is surprising that no charges were made for years 2013 or 2014.


6) Prior to the rent and sponsorship charges being introduced which were deducted from the development school's liability, the club were actually owed approximately £65K therefore it is essential for us to establish what this is about, it all looks too convenient.


7) If the development school has repaid CFC all of its debts but not other creditors and parents, has the club been unfairly preferred and what are the possible consequences should a liquidator be appointed?


8) There is a notable absence of any expenditure being charged by the club to the development school........


9) Finally, given the level of financing provided by the club to the development school, can we conclude that this had the full backing of not only you, but the entire board of directors?

This post has been edited by freelander2: 04 February 2017 - 08:25 PM

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

freelander2, on 04 February 2017 - 07:46 PM, said:

Thank you for working with Ashley Carson & Howard Freeman on this. Our observations directed at AC are as follows:

1) Expenses paid by CFC on behalf of the Development School – Clearly the company owned and managed by Liam Sutcliffe & Chris Turner was unable to obtain lines of credit with their supplier base. Clearly the football club were acting as a financier to their company at a time when Dave Allen was injecting cash into CFC to ensure the club could meet its short term liabilities. Given that during 2014, the club paid £118K of the development school's expenditure, just what percentage of their overall expenditure was that? One imagines a substantial chunk? That being the case, were the club and the development school inextricably linked?


2) Sponsorship Received by CFC on behalf of Development School – During 2015, £15K was deducted off the development school's liability to the club, why would CFC receive sponsorship on behalf of the development school and which sponsor(s) does it relate to? Likewise, does such an arrangement extend to the Community Trust?


3) Rent Charged to CFC by Development School for Village – Again, £24.5K (2015) and £24K (2016) was deducted off the development school's liability to the club. This looks like the club were recharged the entire rental relating to the village, why? Also, please refer to the answer which you gave to question 7 in the list submitted to you prior to the fans' forum on the 9th November where you were asked about this. To remind you:


7) Rent has been charged to the P&L account at £24,500 (2015) and £29,139 (2016). Please confirm if any of the expenditure charged to 'Rent' relates to the accommodation block situated at the front of Simply Gym, Sheffield Road, Chesterfield, known as the 'CFCVillage'?

No. This relates to rent for Pitches / Players Digs. Absolutely no connection with CFC Village

Given that the CFC Village opened during the middle of 2013, who took the decision to recharge the rent to the club for years 2015 & 2016 and more importantly, why?


4) Kit//Pitch Rent/Training – Which totals £9K for 2016. Given what the ex members of staff have told us which you have been made aware of, we believe this requires further investigation.


5) CFC owes Development School – A number of charges have been made to the club covering accommodation, kit, pitch rental and training but these were only introduced during 2015 & 2016. Given that the development school was incorporated late 2012, it is surprising that no charges were made for years 2013 or 2014.


6) Prior to the rent and sponsorship charges being introduced which were deducted from the development school's liability, the club were actually owed approximately £65K therefore it is essential for us to establish what this is about, it all looks too convenient.


7) If the development school has repaid CFC all of its debts but not other creditors and parents, has the club been unfairly preferred and what are the possible consequences should a liquidator be appointed?


8) There is a notable absence of any expenditure being charged by the club to the development school........

9) Finally, given the level of financing provided by the club to the development school, can we conclude that this had the full backing of not only you, but the entire board of directors?

It's nothing to do with the club pml. No wonder we don't have a pot to p in

[Alan Birch]

I think that summarises the issues Freelander2.

Thanks for reaching the summing up stage ahead of the AGM.

Ashley - all of the above require answering ahead of that event, or on the day - but no later.

Well done FR2.

[Guest_freelander2_*]

Alan Birch, on 04 February 2017 - 07:57 PM, said:

I think that summarises the issues Freelander2.

Thanks for reaching the summing up stage ahead of the AGM.

Ashley - all of the above require answering ahead of that event, or on the day - but no later.

Well done FR2.

A joint effort by some decent fans.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

What I'm seeing here is that Chesterfield FC supplied hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of credit to an enterprise run by two individuals occupying senior positions at the Club, despite those same individuals repeatedly denying it.

One of whom was the CFC CEO who presumably 'rubber stamped' tens of thousands of pounds more of 'expenses' paid to the business where he was a director.

And it's yet to be clarified exactly what around five hundred pounds per week worth of 'expenses' were for.

My interpretation.

All those who denied any direct financial support from Town to the DS lied.

And lied.

And lied again.

[Mrhappy]

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, it's all beginning to unravel.

[dim view]

MDCCCLXVI, on 04 February 2017 - 08:17 PM, said:

What I'm seeing here is that Chesterfield FC supplied hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of credit to an enterprise run by two individuals occupying senior positions at the Club, despite those same individuals repeatedly denying it.

Why would Ashley Carson deny this in a BB post last night yet commission a damning audit which he allows to be circulated on here? It's a farce.

[Benno Spire]

Trying hard not to write what I'm thinking as I want to avoid a call or pm

Just wandering who might want to read about this
Police
HMRC
Fraud squad
DA
FA

Toby Perkins needs to ask a few questions the next time he shares a buffet with CT

Or this this just a case of greed, stupidity?

Looking forward to seeing a statement from CT or an interview live on radio with Biggs explaining all the transactions as there must be a valid reason as he doesn't make mistakes

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Benno Spire, on 04 February 2017 - 09:07 PM, said:

Trying hard not to write what I'm thinking as I want to avoid a call or pm

Just wandering who might want to read about this
Police
HMRC
Fraud squad
DA
FA

Toby Perkins needs to ask a few questions the next time he shares a buffet with CT

Or this this just a case of greed, stupidity?

Looking forward to seeing a statement from CT or an interview live on radio with Biggs explaining all the transactions as there must be a valid reason as he doesn't make mistakes

My understanding is that the DS leased training facilities at Gosforth Fields, Dronfield.

I'm also led to believe they then charged CFC for Mark Smith's 'real' academy to train there on a small number of occasions when their own pitches were unavailable.

However it might be interpreted from this that the 'real' academy were regular users of Gosforth Fields - was that really the case?

And if so why was a six figure sum supposedly spent up-grading the Tube Works pitches only for that to happen?

How much did the DS actually pay for the Gosforth Fields facility - was that sum subsidised in part or wholly by CFC?

Apologies for appearing cynical and suspicious, but when we've only the word of proven liars to go on...

PS: these financial figures released by AC (for which I once again give credit - no pun intended - by the way); do they show how much the DS paid for use of the Proact Stadium? For the Portakabin at it's north west corner? Double page spreads in the programme?

[Guest_freelander2_*]

MDCCCLXVI, on 05 February 2017 - 08:21 AM, said:

PS: these financial figures released by AC (for which I once again give credit - no pun intended - by the way); do they show how much the DS paid for use of the Proact Stadium? For the Portakabin at it's north west corner? Double page spreads in the programme?

See point 8 in my post above.

[dim view]

Benno Spire, on 04 February 2017 - 09:07 PM, said:

Trying hard not to write what I'm thinking as I want to avoid a call or pm

Just wandering who might want to read about this

DA

It seems to me probable that the DC appeared as a debtor in every set of monthly accounts since Sutcliffe rode into Chesterfield. Yet Chris Turner, Ashley Carson, John Croot, Chris Breeze have all to my knowledge denied the fact.

No annual accounts have referred to the fact that CFC cash has been providing substantial amounts of credit to a so called independent company in spite of the CEO being a director of that company.

In my opinion the audit report makes it pretty easy to define the date when proper accounting done by AW was replaced by creative accounting done by whoever.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

freelander2, on 05 February 2017 - 08:28 AM, said:

See point 8 in my post above.

A very one-sided relationship, it would appear.

[Ernie Ernie Ernie]

dim view, on 05 February 2017 - 08:44 AM, said:

It seems to me probable that the DC appeared as a debtor in every set of monthly accounts since Sutcliffe rode into Chesterfield. Yet Chris Turner, Ashley Carson, John Croot, Chris Breeze have all to my knowledge denied the fact.

No annual accounts have referred to the fact that CFC cash has been providing substantial amounts of credit to a so called independent company in spite of the CEO being a director of that company.

In my opinion the audit report makes it pretty easy to define the date when proper accounting done by AW was replaced by creative accounting done by whoever.

I've bee going since 1969/70 and I've seen plenty of bad sides and relegations and I can accept another relegation to the basement. What I can't accept is that this years failure is disown to a lack of investment in the squad but it appears we had money but it has been used for an enterprise which is supposedly nothing to do with the club. The apparent rellatiinshio continues, the financial cloud over th club grows. Unless this debacle gets sorted before the end of the season I'm think I'm done and the 3 season tickets won't be renewed.

[meowdmucker]

freelander2, on 04 February 2017 - 07:59 PM, said:

A joint effort by some decent fans.

And I, for one, really appreciate your time and efforts in this. Slowly but surely the truth is coming out.