[JonB]

dim view, on 18 February 2025 - 09:34 AM, said:

You'll be aware of my vast knowledge and experience on financial matters, but wor I reckon we've moved to is a system whereby players signed from the traditional budget - good wages and contract length, signing on fee, agent fee - might have less vigour applied to their fitness level than players signed with a transfer fee from a new recruitment investment budget, using Captains Kirk speculative cash with full backing.

I'm particularly intrigued by Dunkley's injury. Was it historically acknowledged but not investigated properly for severity? Like Danny Rowe?

The podcast recently they talked about how they now use a much more modern in depth at fairly considerable cost for any transfers deemed over a certain cost (presumably fees and wages) which is what highlighted the issues with the two transfers that fell through in January, lad from York and the Canadian lad i think, but whether that was in place in the summer for transfers and then whether it would have been used for a few of the out of contract signings is another matter.

In terms of Dunkley he seems to have played regular basis most seasons bar when he broke his leg in Feb 2020 playing for Wigan that kept him out for good while so if the neck thing is a historical issue it hasnt stopped him playing before.

[dim view]

JonB, on 18 February 2025 - 09:50 AM, said:

In terms of Dunkley he seems to have played regular basis most seasons bar when he broke his leg in Feb 2020 playing for Wigan that kept him out for good while so if the neck thing is a historical issue it hasn't stopped him playing before.

Precisely.
So it didn't adversely affect his previous club but it has us. Whether it was known about, monitored, and affected their retainment plans for him would be an interesting question.

[Trigger]

Middle East, on 18 February 2025 - 09:44 AM, said:

Yes free parking at the ground

Sound, cheers

[JonB]

dim view, on 18 February 2025 - 10:10 AM, said:

Precisely.
So it didn't adversely affect his previous club but it has us. Whether it was known about, monitored, and affected their retainment plans for him would be an interesting question.

Well he is under contract until June 2027 so unless he retires due to the injury he isnt going anywhere unless paid off. It doesnt appear to have stopped him training and its never been fully cleared up what he did and why its stopping him doing more so its guesswork whether its something that has been missed on signing, unlikely seeing as he was ever present prior to the issue, and where it goes from here.

[dim view]

JonB, on 18 February 2025 - 10:36 AM, said:

Well he is under contract until June 2027 so unless he retires due to the injury he isnt going anywhere unless paid off. It doesnt appear to have stopped him training and its never been fully cleared up what he did and why its stopping him doing more so its guesswork whether its something that has been missed on signing, unlikely seeing as he was ever present prior to the issue, and where it goes from here.

Did we pay a fee for him?
If so I assume under the new set up he'd have been fast tracked for an expensive medical.

[Westbars Spireite]

dim view, on 18 February 2025 - 10:41 AM, said:

Did we pay a fee for him?
If so I assume under the new set up he'd have been fast tracked for an expensive medical.

He was out of contract at Shrewsbury.

[boot]

JonB, on 18 February 2025 - 10:36 AM, said:

Well he is under contract until June 2027 so unless he retires due to the injury he isnt going anywhere unless paid off. It doesnt appear to have stopped him training and its never been fully cleared up what he did and why its stopping him doing more so its guesswork whether its something that has been missed on signing, unlikely seeing as he was ever present prior to the issue, and where it goes from here.

It hasn't stopped him training, but who wants a defender who can't head the ball. As for the signing of older players or any players it is all about due diligence and medicals. If they are deemed fit to sign based on that then sign them, but you have to wonder if that has been the case. Latterly it does appear to have been the case with the two recent players who have failed very stringent medicals. Maybe that is because the Kirk's have now seen the red light flashing and triggered by the signing of so many players who have contributed next to nothing.

[JonB]

dim view, on 18 February 2025 - 10:41 AM, said:

Did we pay a fee for him?
If so I assume under the new set up he'd have been fast tracked for an expensive medical.

I got the impression from the podcast the medical thing is only a recent thing so probably wasnt in place at the start of the season and also only for deals that are over a certain point. I suspect this is both fee and contract combined. Potentially going forward it could be that if someone is signed having been out of contract it could still trigger it if the contract is an expensive one.

[JonB]

boot, on 18 February 2025 - 11:04 AM, said:

It hasn't stopped him training, but who wants a defender who can't head the ball. As for the signing of older players or any players it is all about due diligence and medicals. If they are deemed fit to sign based on that then sign them, but you have to wonder if that has been the case. Latterly it does appear to have been the case with the two recent players who have failed very stringent medicals. Maybe that is because the Kirk's have now seen the red light flashing and triggered by the signing of so many players who have contributed next to nothing.

I never said they would want a defender who can head it but it suggests that once he gets the all clear to play he should be pretty much good to go straight away, its not going to be like many others who have had to get up to speed when coming back. It was never made clear how the injury came about but as i mentioned previously bar a spell from a broken leg he has played on a consistent basis throughout his career so doubt its something that would have been picked up on a medical.

[Osborne again]

Middle East, on 18 February 2025 - 08:41 AM, said:

The problem with that strategy would be that it reduces the options we have. Decent quality players between 23 to 30 tend to cost more, both in terms of transfer fees and wages.

I fully agree that we should probably try to reduce the amount at either end of the scale slightly, but it's a financial fact of life for most lower league clubs that players at the end of their careers and ones starting out are more affordable. Cook has been backed, but we still aren't a Wrexham, so a blend of youth and experience is still essential to a degree with the budget he's got. You don't want a team full of of 25-30 year bang average players.

Whichever way you look at it our injury crisis has been unprecedented, going back to the pre season game where Sheff Utd came and kicked us off the park. They did for Palmer and Shecks if memory serves me right, not to mention nearly laming Naylor. Then Madden got crocked the game after. Without some of the injuries who knows how far up the table we would be...

Don't forget Mike Jones too, he got raked down his Achilles in the same game.

[Middle East]

Strong line up for the friendly. 2-0 at half time. Donacian looking very steady and Metcalfe has been pretty industrious. Though its very much a set of young lads they are up against so hard to judge.

Drummond and Hobson putting a shift in too. Vonte, Jacobs and Fleck looking a bit off the pace to me though.

Fleck and Donacian off for second half. Cook and Witney (if I heard right) on.

This post has been edited by Middle East: 18 February 2025 - 02:08 PM

[Westbars Spireite]

Middle East, on 18 February 2025 - 02:04 PM, said:

Strong line up for the friendly. 2-0 at half time. Donacian looking very steady and Metcalfe has been pretty industrious. Though its very much a set of young lads they are up against so hard to judge.

Drummond and Hobson putting a shift in too. Vote, Jacobs and Fleck looking a bit off the pace to me though.

Fleck and Donacian off for second half. Cook and Witney (if I heard right) on.

I wonder if those two coming off is a clue as to Saturday.

[Middle East]

Westbars Spireite, on 18 February 2025 - 02:08 PM, said:

I wonder if those two coming off is a clue as to Saturday.

Who knows mate. Banks has now come off and Mandy on. To be fair Metcalfe and Drummond have been our best two. Drummond just bagged his second after a long punt from Boot. He took it really well.

Donacian played centre half and looked good so it could be that he replaces Williams or Shecks. Fleck still looks unfit to me.

This post has been edited by Middle East: 18 February 2025 - 02:37 PM

[Westbars Spireite]

Middle East, on 18 February 2025 - 02:34 PM, said:

Who knows mate. Banks has now come off and Mandy on. To be fair Metcalfe and Drummond have been our best two. Drummond just bagged his second after a long punt from Boot. He took it really well.

Donacian played centre half and looked good so it could be that he replaces Williams or Shecks. Fleck still looks unfit to me.

I saw the first half and came home as my feet were cold ;-)

[Middle East]

Westbars Spireite, on 18 February 2025 - 02:52 PM, said:

I saw the first half and came home as my feet were cold ;-)

My mate left at half time too, so there's 2 nesh bu99ers out there!

It was a bit nippy to be fair!

[dim view]

Middle East, on 18 February 2025 - 02:34 PM, said:

Fleck still looks unfit to me.

Still managed to complete every pass into the right place at the right pace.
It's a significant day today if Donacien, Fleck, and Palmer are up to competitive fitness. I enjoyed it and maybe we can repeat it. Some energetic forward play by Hobson and Drummond, spoilt on the day by some poor final balls.

I think we should put a bid in for Metcalfe.

[prolurker]

Donacien and Fleck being in for Saturday wouldn?t surprise me. Two senior pro?s Cookie should be able to trust to make better decisions than we?ve been seeing.

Hope both can stay fit 🤞

[dim view]

prolurker, on 18 February 2025 - 03:57 PM, said:

Donacien and Fleck being in for Saturday wouldn?t surprise me. Two senior pro?s Cookie should be able to trust to make better decisions than we?ve been seeing.

Hope both can stay fit 🤞

As Middle East observed, Fleck might not quite be ready yet. He didn't do any sprinting but maybe he had no reason to on the day. Still very effective though.

[DIFH]

dim view, on 18 February 2025 - 03:56 PM, said:

Still managed to complete every pass into the right place at the right pace.
It's a significant day today if Donacien, Fleck, and Palmer are up to competitive fitness. I enjoyed it and maybe we can repeat it. Some energetic forward play by Hobson and Drummond, spoilt on the day by some poor final balls.

I think we should put a bid in for Metcalfe.

Wonder if Cook will want to change things after Wallsall

[Mr Mercury]

DIFH, on 18 February 2025 - 04:42 PM, said:

Wonder if Cook will want to change things after Wallsall

After his interview I?d say it?s certain.