[sophocles]

The logical ultimate result of VAR is that football will consist of players shuffling carefully around the pitch with their arms pinned straight down their sides like two teams of geriatric penguins. Nobody will run or jump in the air because that requires you to raise legs and arms which, in slow motion, makes it look as if you are assaulting an opponent. I want promotion for us, but not to the extent that we eventually get into completely idiotic VAR territory. I don't agree with the view that it's too late to stop it - why? Just totally scrap it tomorrow and get on with enjoying the game without constant stupid interruptions.

[Osborne again]

VAR is a good idea on paper, but a waste of time in reality because it's being used for the wrong decisions. Clear and obvious mistakes are not some striker being offside by a bootlace. The red card last night was for intent because he hardly made contact with the player, but do we want our game spoilt by overzealous officials sat in a studio somewhere, I don't.

[JonB]

Wouldn’t be so bad if decisions were consistent….last nights var interference to say it was a red card came the same day a worse tackle by a hull player at Hillsborough on New Year’s Day that saw a guy sent off was overturned on appeal!

Video of the tackle here from a couple of angles.
https://x.com/hull_a...tFgOBKfesD-h06w
https://x.com/refsup...tFgOBKfesD-h06w

This post has been edited by JonB: 05 January 2024 - 08:30 AM

[Waller is my hero]

VAR is just an embarrassment & the refs need sanctioning for their decisions

[FORZA AZZURRI]

Var want to make sure the ref was aware studs up straight leg and contact was made ….

In fact was minimal contact..

The ref needed to have stood by his on field decision but bottled it

Var is good but only if used correctly.

[Osborne again]

JonB, on 05 January 2024 - 08:26 AM, said:

Wouldn’t be so bad if decisions were consistent….last nights var interference to say it was a red card came the same day a worse tackle by a hull player at Hillsborough on New Year’s Day that saw a guy sent off was overturned on appeal!

Video of the tackle here from a couple of angles.
https://x.com/hull_a...tFgOBKfesD-h06w
https://x.com/refsup...tFgOBKfesD-h06w

And you've hit the nail on its head. The decision is ultimately down to the ref but more and more we're seeing decisions that aren't consistent. Another problem is the time taken over decisions. If it takes a VAR official upwards of four minutes to give the ref the chance to change his decision then it isn't clear and obvious.
The red last night, as I said previously, was for intent, but I would have thought a yellow card would have been a fairer outcome.
Another one that bugs me is hand ball decisions in and around the 18 yd area. Defenders now have to play the game looking like they've been arrested by the local plod. Anyone who's ever played the game will tell you if it's deliberate or not. Probably time for officials to get some training on body positions in different scenarios during a game, or just get a life.

[JonB]

Osborne again, on 05 January 2024 - 10:26 AM, said:

And you've hit the nail on its head. The decision is ultimately down to the ref but more and more we're seeing decisions that aren't consistent. Another problem is the time taken over decisions. If it takes a VAR official upwards of four minutes to give the ref the chance to change his decision then it isn't clear and obvious.
The red last night, as I said previously, was for intent, but I would have thought a yellow card would have been a fairer outcome.
Another one that bugs me is hand ball decisions in and around the 18 yd area. Defenders now have to play the game looking like they've been arrested by the local plod. Anyone who's ever played the game will tell you if it's deliberate or not. Probably time for officials to get some training on body positions in different scenarios during a game, or just get a life.

Handball law is a particular bug bear for a lot of people….its been changed around so much to try and make it work with VAR that it’s now complicated and confusing to the point I’m not sure anyone knows what is handball and what isn’t these days. We’ve got to a point where it’s different for attackers to defender as well!!


They should be making VAR work with the laws not changing the laws to make VAR work.

[Zeus]

FORZA AZZURRI, on 05 January 2024 - 09:45 AM, said:

Var want to make sure the ref was aware studs up straight leg and contact was made ….

In fact was minimal contact..

The ref needed to have stood by his on field decision but bottled it

Var is good but only if used correctly.

You must understand it will never be used correctly for a consistent period of time. It is operated by humans. We ought to accept that. Is not watching us play without VAR and getting wound up by a ref from time to time so much more exciting than the stale dead time you get with everyone stood waiting? That can never ever be eradicated while VAR is in place.

[Zeus]

JonB, on 29 November 2023 - 09:09 AM, said:

I was always a bit halfway house about tech in football, i could see a place for things like hawkeye for goal line decisions, even potentially some way of doing offsides but i struggled to see how video replays would work. The games it works in best, potentially rugby aside, are the stop start sports like cricket, NFL, tennis etc. That natural break in play allows for the reviews to happen and they have refined their processes in those sports to where they are now that seem to work very well. There is no natural break in football so when VAR kicks in and delays things its massively noticeable and happens at strange times with play having to be taken back or offside decisions are left to play out then given 20 seconds later etc.

They've also started changing laws to make VAR work instead of making VAR work with the laws so we've ended up with things like stupid handball rules that seem to be done differently in different leagues, clear and obvious error has gone out the window as they look at umpteen replays almost trying to find a reason to get involved and at times the wrong decision is still reached. Its just all really clunky and wedged in feel to it as they thought they had to use it after calls from certain people but with no real thought as to how to do it.

I was at a Serie B game in Italy on Saturday and they were using it there....had no idea until about 5mins in they took ages to award a goal and turned out it was because they were checking an offside decision in the build up. The game was covered by a main camera, a couple of cameras about halfway into each half presumably to do offsides then when looked like a couple of CCTV cameras that were along the goal line that must have been for hawkeye type things.


I do wonder if there needs to be a level of something between yellow card and red card these days. The way yellow cards are handed out for things its having a massive impact on games. When you get yellow cards for really minor little things but its basically the same punishment as someone hauling someone down in a cynical manner to prevent an attack in a so called taking one for the team booking (Mike Jones special this season!). You do see sometimes folk being taken out quite crudely to stop attacks and its punished the same way as a tug of the shirt. Not sure if it should be a sin bin or another level of card in between yellow and red for example.

Even in tennis, they have started using video review beyond line calls to judge if a ball has bounced twice before a player has hit it and though rare, whenever I've seen it used, it's been absolutely shambolic. Huge delays, temperamental technology, inconclusive evidence.

[Osborne again]

JonB, on 05 January 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

Handball law is a particular bug bear for a lot of people….its been changed around so much to try and make it work with VAR that it’s now complicated and confusing to the point I’m not sure anyone knows what is handball and what isn’t these days. We’ve got to a point where it’s different for attackers to defender as well!!


They should be making VAR work with the laws not changing the laws to make VAR work.

It's the lovechild of some gormless balloon who won't admit he's got it wrong, so has to meddle with the laws of the game to make him right.

[s42blue]

FORZA AZZURRI, on 05 January 2024 - 09:45 AM, said:

Var want to make sure the ref was aware studs up straight leg and contact was made ….

In fact was minimal contact..

The ref needed to have stood by his on field decision but bottled it

Var is good but only if used correctly.

I said the same. Ref had a great view of the incident and gave nothing so for VAR to get involved in the first place was wrong. Then he should have stuck to his on field decision.

Sadly it was no surprise he “bottled it”.

[JonB]

s42blue, on 05 January 2024 - 11:48 AM, said:

I said the same. Ref had a great view of the incident and gave nothing so for VAR to get involved in the first place was wrong. Then he should have stuck to his on field decision.

Sadly it was no surprise he “bottled it”.

Problem is I don’t think they are asked to have another look as such and then make a decision. They are recommended to change the decisions and shown footage as to why which is why nearly everything is overturned. It was explained in one of the Michael Owen/Howard Webb VAR explaining shows.

There was a handball decision a while ago where the ref said no pen from a great view then it was overturned by VAR from replays with a worse view because of players in the line of view.

[sophocles]

FORZA AZZURRI, on 05 January 2024 - 09:45 AM, said:

Var want to make sure the ref was aware studs up straight leg and contact was made ….

In fact was minimal contact..

The ref needed to have stood by his on field decision but bottled it

Var is good but only if used correctly.

Disagree - VAR is not good, in fact it is a poison that is ruining the game. The professed aim of getting every decision correct is absolutely impossible unless you utterly wipe out the pace, drama and excitement of the game by analysing every incident minutely. I'd much rather keep the pace and intensity which is the very essence of football, and put up with the occasional refereeing error. Just get rid of the utterly idiotic monstrosity that is so obviously destroying the game.

[ronpowellsbutler]

sophocles, on 05 January 2024 - 12:38 PM, said:

Disagree - VAR is not good, in fact it is a poison that is ruining the game. The professed aim of getting every decision correct is absolutely impossible unless you utterly wipe out the pace, drama and excitement of the game by analysing every incident minutely. I'd much rather keep the pace and intensity which is the very essence of football, and put up with the occasional refereeing error. Just get rid of the utterly idiotic monstrosity that is so obviously destroying the game.

I think VAR should only be used for the ball going out of play.
We wouldn’t have complained if it was in use in 1997.

This post has been edited by ronpowellsbutler: 05 January 2024 - 12:51 PM

[Osborne again]

sophocles, on 05 January 2024 - 12:38 PM, said:

Disagree - VAR is not good, in fact it is a poison that is ruining the game. The professed aim of getting every decision correct is absolutely impossible unless you utterly wipe out the pace, drama and excitement of the game by analysing every incident minutely. I'd much rather keep the pace and intensity which is the very essence of football, and put up with the occasional refereeing error. Just get rid of the utterly idiotic monstrosity that is so obviously destroying the game.

I've no doubt, it could have gained us points, as well as lost us a couple, if we'd got the system in our league. To be honest, I'll back the half witted officials we get lumbered with every week against VAR to keep the game moving, and that's saying something.

[JonB]

ronpowellsbutler, on 05 January 2024 - 12:50 PM, said:

I think VAR should only be used for the ball going out of play.
We wouldn’t have complained if it was in use in 1997.

Var isn’t used for goaline decisions, that’s different tech which has been in place for years and works fine. As shown a couple of times this season, both against Arsenal, just looking at camera pictures doesn’t work for the ball crossing a line.

[Brookie]

Like any decision in football it’s all down to interpretation of the rules therefore it’s down to the individual concerned as to how they see it, VAR will never be definitive

[sophocles]

Line technology is fine, because it works quickly, and doesn't disrupt the flow of the game. It's the only technology that should be retained.

[JonB]

sophocles, on 05 January 2024 - 02:29 PM, said:

Line technology is fine, because it works quickly, and doesn't disrupt the flow of the game. It's the only technology that should be retained.

The semi automated offside stuff is worth using and keeping as well. Only prem still insisting on human lines that take an age.

[fishini]

Just let each team ask for var say twice much like cricket. Then it is down wholly to the ref