[60s 70s Spireite]

dim view, on 04 March 2021 - 11:20 AM, said:

....Asante has got to be attracting attention. Strong, fit, persistent, team player, no temperament problems, sees a pass, scores goals. What a find!

He certainly is. As he’s playing at the moment he’s easily L1 standard.

[azul]

dim view, on 04 March 2021 - 11:20 AM, said:

....Asante has got to be attracting attention. Strong, fit, persistent, team player, no temperament problems, sees a pass, scores goals. What a find!

Hard to believe he has been plying his trade in non league for so long.

[BurySpireite]

xG is a really useful stat taken in the context of what it actually means.

Just because it's flawed it doesn't make it useless.

[azul]

Just watched the club highlights - what a lovely goal that was especially the finish

Probably like many I spent sometime bemoaning us not taking shots early enough - ironically I expect if Asante had taken that first time the shot would’ve been blocked

[sophocles]

BurySpireite, on 04 March 2021 - 03:13 PM, said:

xG is a really useful stat taken in the context of what it actually means.

Just because it's flawed it doesn't make it useless.

Well I, for one, can't see any use for it. Perhaps you could explain.

[spireitetoo]

JonB, on 04 March 2021 - 11:22 AM, said:

Not sure what contact we signed him up on but you wonder if an extension like we have with Rowe could be on the cards. Whilst you cant always stop them moving it would be good to ensure we get the maximum we can if he was to go. Lets be honest if Fondop can end up at Charlton then from what we have seen with Asante he should be interesting teams.

Fondop's at Burton, but see what ya mean.

Some strikers take time to mature, perfect their talent, to what ages where Ian Wright, or Jamie Vardy playing non league?

This post has been edited by spireitetoo: 04 March 2021 - 04:54 PM

[h again]

Mr Mercury, on 03 March 2021 - 09:37 PM, said:

A player can be cautioned or sent off at anytime, the ball doesn't need to be in play. Players often get carded in the tunnel.

Yes I appreciate that - what seems a bit grey is what you can get away with in Tuesdays situation. The ref thought it was a goal, the linesman flagged for something, presumably offside, so goal disallowed. But the ball was still in play when the fool handled it, so should he have been cautioned, or sent off by my rules?
I'd say yes, but as the ref suffered from acute optical trauma he got away with it.
Which obviously embarrassed the ref when he realised what he'd missed, so he booked Loz to console himself.

[born in 1866]

Mr Mercury, on 03 March 2021 - 09:37 PM, said:

A player can be cautioned or sent off at anytime, the ball doesn't need to be in play. Players often get carded in the tunnel.

Not for handball they don't

This post has been edited by born in 1866: 04 March 2021 - 07:01 PM

[BurySpireite]

sophocles, on 04 March 2021 - 03:47 PM, said:

Well I, for one, can't see any use for it. Perhaps you could explain.

I find it really useful for fantasy prem for one! Shows which players are receiving a high volume of good quality chances even if they're not putting them away. You can tell then if they're a player who you know should generally finish chances at a rate equal to or above the average then they should revert towards the mean and begin performing better soon (which they usually do).

Alternatively, for players like Son who consistently outperform their xG you know that even when Tottenham aren't creating many chances he'll still score fairly frequently because he's very clinical. The other side to this is that at the start of the season he was outscoring his xG to a ridiculous and unsustainable degree, to the point where it was obvious he would decline a little from the xG figures in a way that simply looking at shots vs shots converted wouldn't tell you. He was converting a really high number of shots from range which would usually only have a low chance of being converted.

Looking at the expected table based on xG and xGA has Brighton third (!?!) I believe. Which shows that Graham Potter is doing a much better job than it may seem looking at the table in assembling a squad which plays creative attacking football and minimises chances against, but that they haven't been getting the rub of the green. It also says that his players can't hit a barn door from 5 yards though...

I'm not saying any of this is stuff people couldn't find out from just watching games. But it allows statistical analysis and an actual quantifiable metric to prove them and allow comparison. That's just a very small sample of the ways it can be used, I'm no football expert by any means but I've found it really useful personally.

[sophocles]

BurySpireite, on 04 March 2021 - 07:14 PM, said:

I find it really useful for fantasy prem for one! Shows which players are receiving a high volume of good quality chances even if they're not putting them away. You can tell then if they're a player who you know should generally finish chances at a rate equal to or above the average then they should revert towards the mean and begin performing better soon (which they usually do).

Alternatively, for players like Son who consistently outperform their xG you know that even when Tottenham aren't creating many chances he'll still score fairly frequently because he's very clinical. The other side to this is that at the start of the season he was outscoring his xG to a ridiculous and unsustainable degree, to the point where it was obvious he would decline a little from the xG figures in a way that simply looking at shots vs shots converted wouldn't tell you. He was converting a really high number of shots from range which would usually only have a low chance of being converted.

Looking at the expected table based on xG and xGA has Brighton third (!?!) I believe. Which shows that Graham Potter is doing a much better job than it may seem looking at the table in assembling a squad which plays creative attacking football and minimises chances against, but that they haven't been getting the rub of the green. It also says that his players can't hit a barn door from 5 yards though...

I'm not saying any of this is stuff people couldn't find out from just watching games. But it allows statistical analysis and an actual quantifiable metric to prove them and allow comparison. That's just a very small sample of the ways it can be used, I'm no football expert by any means but I've found it really useful personally.

Thanks for that. I'm glad it's of some use to somebody.

[Wooden Spoon]

h again said:

1614882531[/url]' post='1565592']
Yes I appreciate that - what seems a bit grey is what you can get away with in Tuesdays situation. The ref thought it was a goal, the linesman flagged for something, presumably offside, so goal disallowed. But the ball was still in play when the fool handled it, so should he have been cautioned, or sent off by my rules?
I'd say yes, but as the ref suffered from acute optical trauma he got away with it.
Which obviously embarrassed the ref when he realised what he'd missed, so he booked Loz to console himself.

What did the Lino give? Offside or handball?



If it was off side, then both him and the Lino missed it, so wouldn’t yellow card the player for hand ball. And then when loz says “ref your eff8ng blind” he gets a yellow for dissent.

[clarevoyant.]

DEATH, on 04 March 2021 - 08:34 PM, said:

What did the Lino give? Offside or handball?

The positioning of the Lino's flag suggests he was indicating offside.

If it was off side, then both him and the Lino missed it, so wouldn’t yellow card the player for hand ball. And then when loz says “ref your eff8ng blind” he gets a yellow for dissent.

The positioning of the linesman flag suggests he was indicating offside.

This post has been edited by clarevoyant.: 04 March 2021 - 09:15 PM

[JonB]

DEATH, on 04 March 2021 - 08:34 PM, said:

What did the Lino give? Offside or handball?



If it was off side, then both him and the Lino missed it, so wouldn’t yellow card the player for hand ball. And then when loz says “ref your eff8ng blind” he gets a yellow for dissent.

Lino gave offside, he had his flag pointing across the field to signal that. If he’d given handball he would have pointed his flag up the pitch instead.

[Wooden Spoon]

That’s what I thought, so none of them saw a handball - probably why loz got his booking for calling the ref

[60s 70s Spireite]

moondog, on 03 March 2021 - 10:54 PM, said:

For a 1-0 win, the stats are amazing

Match stats v Eastleigh:
🔵xG: 1.8 (East 0)
🔵Shots/on target: 19/4 (East 0)
🔵Passes/accurate: 507/419 - 82.64% (East: 227/145 - 63.88%
🔵Possession: 64.56% (East 35.44%)
🔵Duels/won: 253/135 (East 253/108)
Eastleigh were 8 unbeaten 😳
Total domination 👊
#Spireites https://t.co/mBnsyboeKd

On cue, the BBC is today reporting the rise and importance of football data experts
https://www.bbc.co.u...siness-56164159

[clarevoyant.]

DEATH, on 04 March 2021 - 10:25 PM, said:

That’s what I thought, so none of them saw a handball - probably why loz got his booking for calling the ref

The other way to judge what the officials saw?? be it offside or handball, is how did they restart the game? Direct or indirect free kick?

[Westbars Spireite]

clarevoyant., on 05 March 2021 - 08:24 AM, said:

The other way to judge what the officials saw?? be it offside or handball, is how did they restart the game? Direct or indirect free kick?

I didn't see that, but the lino's flag position indicated offside at the time to me.

[clarevoyant.]

Westbars Spireite, on 05 March 2021 - 08:27 AM, said:

I didn't see that, but the lino's flag position indicated offside at the time to me.

Correct and he stood his ground whereas if he'd been giving another infringement and awiting the ref to concur he would have been obliged to follow the flight of the ball, incase a decision was required as too whether the ball had crossed the line.

[dtp]

clarevoyant., on 05 March 2021 - 08:35 AM, said:

Correct and he stood his ground whereas if he'd been giving another infringement and awiting the ref to concur he would have been obliged to follow the flight of the ball, incase a decision was required as too whether the ball had crossed the line.

Ok. So, when players are given a belated red card on review by the authorities because the ref didn't see an incident and didn't give a yellow who and what decides they review said incident? They are supposed to be trying to come down hard on cheating yet Loz's yellow card won't get rescinded because he told the ref about the incident yet the actual deliberate handball which the men in black didn't see goes unpunished. So the fact the ref was actually told by Maguire about the incident and as such booked him should logically be included in his report as the reason he issued the yellow card. However, it appears this will not be reviewed even though the ref initially appeared to award a goal and was only saved by the linesman flagging for offside bearing in mind had the offside flag not been raised we could have lost 3 points as a result of a player cheating. Seems, then, it's ok and Strevens needs to have a strong word with his player and tell him next time he punches the ball into the net to make sure he is onside.

[clarevoyant.]

dtp, on 05 March 2021 - 09:17 AM, said:

Ok. So, when players are given a belated red card on review by the authorities because the ref didn't see an incident and didn't give a yellow who and what decides they review said incident? They are supposed to be trying to come down hard on cheating yet Loz's yellow card won't get rescinded because he told the ref about the incident yet the actual deliberate handball which the men in black didn't see goes unpunished. So the fact the ref was actually told by Maguire about the incident and as such booked him should logically be included in his report as the reason he issued the yellow card. However, it appears this will not be reviewed even though the ref initially appeared to award a goal and was only saved by the linesman flagging for offside bearing in mind had the offside flag not been raised we could have lost 3 points as a result of a player cheating. Seems, then, it's ok and Strevens needs to have a strong word with his player and tell him next time he punches the ball into the net to make sure he is onside.

History, over the last 10ish seasons leads to the conclusion that as a club we don't have it in our DNA to benefit from crap game changing decisions only suffer.

Here's hoping things change, JR has mentioned it a couple of times, perhaps his presence can alter our luckp