[dim view]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 25 April 2020 - 07:09 AM, said:

As we suspected: https://www.msn.com/...ocid=spartandhp

To put it in Town terms, a Carson-esque 'eyes and ears' on the inside or, perhaps, Coe like cronyism?

Either way I look forward to all those advocating Brexit to rid ourselves of such shady unelected officials reacting with equal outrage...

Alistair Campbell set the precedent.

Even more worrying for Boris is the undoubted presence of a mole in the ranks.

[isleaiw1]

dim view, on 25 April 2020 - 07:30 AM, said:

Yep, same for B & Q.
I missed the reporting of the Hancock interview when he was asked the specific question. B & Q, and presumably lots of other similar stores, were never instructed to close but did so anyway.

So, my nearest store is Sutton 5 miles away and I can presumably just jump in my car and buy things of a non essential nature.

Yep, seems that way. I see DT carrying a piece on staff being unhappy about Chesterfield store reopening as most of what they sell isnt essential. Either B&Q mgt have pulled a blinder and will be quids in keeping the nations people busy with DIY whilst they are in lockdown (which of course will stop them going out as much perhaps) or they will get crucified for their profiteering opportunism - especially if one of their front line staff takes ill. Not sure if I was on theie exec I would be voting in favour of full opening - especially as they went from a few trial stores to whole estate in about three days.

I'll let you know how full the car park is at the one I pass on my dog walk later....

[dim view]

isleaiw1, on 25 April 2020 - 09:14 AM, said:

Yep, seems that way. I see DT carrying a piece on staff being unhappy about Chesterfield store reopening as most of what they sell isnt essential. Either B&Q mgt have pulled a blinder and will be quids in keeping the nations people busy with DIY whilst they are in lockdown (which of course will stop them going out as much perhaps) or they will get crucified for their profiteering opportunism - especially if one of their front line staff takes ill. Not sure if I was on theie exec I would be voting in favour of full opening - especially as they went from a few trial stores to whole estate in about three days.

I'll let you know how full the car park is at the one I pass on my dog walk later....

They will be wanting to get rid of all their plants.

[Search & Destroy]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 25 April 2020 - 07:09 AM, said:

As we suspected: https://www.msn.com/...ocid=spartandhp

To put it in Town terms, a Carson-esque 'eyes and ears' on the inside or, perhaps, Coe like cronyism?

Either way I look forward to all those advocating Brexit to rid ourselves of such shady unelected officials reacting with equal outrage...

Last week it was a disgrace BJ wasn’t at a COBRA meeting

This week it’s a disgrace one of his advisors is at a SAGE meeting

[fishini]

Search and Destroy, on 25 April 2020 - 09:37 AM, said:

Last week it was a disgrace BJ wasn’t at a COBRA meeting

This week it’s a disgrace one of his advisors is at a SAGE meeting

Both are correct. Don't forget it was Cummings that adviced herd immunity to save the economy, with horrendous death rates predicted. This shows just where his priorities really lie

[Search & Destroy]

fishini, on 25 April 2020 - 09:47 AM, said:

Both are correct. Don't forget it was Cummings that adviced herd immunity to save the economy, with horrendous death rates predicted. This shows just where his priorities really lie

Would have taken advice that was available at the time

May have worked, may not have done, at the moment we have horrendous death rates and a crippled economy

[fishini]

Search and Destroy, on 25 April 2020 - 09:54 AM, said:

Would have taken advice that was available at the time

May have worked, may not have done, at the moment we have horrendous death rates and a crippled economy

The death rates now as bad as they are would have paled into insignificance had his advice been taken. He is not a member of the government and as such should not be at meetings like this one. He is an awful man who set on an advisor who believed in eugenics for god's sake. What do you think of him?

[Search & Destroy]

eugenics, I think Misnomer would go for for that too

[fishini]

Search and Destroy, on 25 April 2020 - 10:16 AM, said:

eugenics, I think Misnomer would go for for that too

Again what is your opinion of Cummings?

[azul]

Search and Destroy, on 25 April 2020 - 09:37 AM, said:

Last week it was a disgrace BJ wasn’t at a COBRA meeting

This week it’s a disgrace one of his advisors is at a SAGE meeting

I agree totally with what you've just typed, if not the sentiment.

Different meetings with different agendas and antendees - the clues are in the acronyms

COBR - Cabinet Office Briefing Rooms
Covers the government response to a crisis and will include ministers, advisors civil servants and other relevant parties
SAGE - Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies
Responsible for ensuring that timely and coordinated scientific advice is made available to decision makers in the Cabinet Office Briefing Room (COBR)

Therefore SAGE advises COBR (not the other way around) but it is a fair assumption that exactly what Cummings was doing, otherwise what was he doing there?

This post has been edited by azul: 25 April 2020 - 11:17 AM

[Westbars Spireite]

dim view, on 25 April 2020 - 07:30 AM, said:

Yep, same for B & Q.
I missed the reporting of the Hancock interview when he was asked the specific question. B & Q, and presumably lots of other similar stores, were never instructed to close but did so anyway.

So, my nearest store is Sutton 5 miles away and I can presumably just jump in my car and buy things of a non essential nature.

Absolutely. Would you get me a washing line pole while you're there? I broke mine playing cricket with the kids.

[Blue5]

isleaiw1, on 25 April 2020 - 09:14 AM, said:

Yep, seems that way. I see DT carrying a piece on staff being unhappy about Chesterfield store reopening as most of what they sell isnt essential. Either B&Q mgt have pulled a blinder and will be quids in keeping the nations people busy with DIY whilst they are in lockdown (which of course will stop them going out as much perhaps) or they will get crucified for their profiteering opportunism - especially if one of their front line staff takes ill. Not sure if I was on theie exec I would be voting in favour of full opening - especially as they went from a few trial stores to whole estate in about three days.

I'll let you know how full the car park is at the one I pass on my dog walk later....

If businesses were receiving grants from the Government covering 80% of their turnover and employees were left with the thin end of nothing, would those employees be as equally or less concerned about their well-being as they are currently?

This post has been edited by Blue5: 25 April 2020 - 11:34 AM

[Blue5]

isleaiw1, on 24 April 2020 - 09:34 AM, said:

And the ones who will be crying out for more help when they have no money if their job goes t*ts up.

Absolutely, the Jeremy and Miranda types down the B&Q buying their essential hot tubs!

[Search & Destroy]

Don’t know anything about him

But assuming SAGE update the Government after their meetings anyway I can’t see the issue with someone listening in first hand

Sounds to me that it’s another flashback to Brexit

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search and Destroy, on 25 April 2020 - 09:37 AM, said:

Last week it was a disgrace BJ wasn’t at a COBRA meeting

This week it’s a disgrace one of his advisors is at a SAGE meeting

Fishini's spot on - there is no dichotomy.

Yet there's a huge dichotomy between dubbing folk 'condescending metropolitan elitists' for suggesting the British public were conned over Brexit and you distrusting that same British public over Corona. Just as there's a huge dichotomy between trashing unelected EU bureaucrats whilst defending unelected UK bureaucrats. Sitting in meetings they're totally unqualified to attend, of course.

But anyway, this highly respected journalist pretty much sums things up for me:

'Stay on message, protect your backside, save your job'. Couldn't have put it better myself.

By the way, the question about Priti Patel dubbing everyone below twenty five grand pa unskilled and unwelcome is apt in terms of those nurses treating your mate Bozo. Were they on more or less than that? Because the truth is they and hundreds and thousands of others might not have been here were the tories' election policies already in place...

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

dim view, on 25 April 2020 - 08:07 AM, said:

Alistair Campbell set the precedent.

Even more worrying for Boris is the undoubted presence of a mole in the ranks.

Did he? Y'mean 'SAGE' meetings during, say, the 'Foot and Mouth' epidemic? Gonna have to ask for a link or two here, Dave.

As for any 'mole' undermining Bozo, let's remember the Telegraph paid him nearly three hundred grand pa for him publicly undermining Teresa May...

[dim view]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 25 April 2020 - 11:58 AM, said:

Did he? Y'mean 'SAGE' meetings during, say, the 'Foot and Mouth' epidemic? Gonna have to ask for a link or two here, Dave.

As for any 'mole' undermining Bozo, let's remember the Telegraph paid him nearly three hundred grand pa for him publicly undermining Teresa May...

UK: Politics

Campbell attacked for 'untrammelled power'

Alastair Campbell: accused of wielding power without responsibility
Alastair Campbell is at the heart of a fresh political row after the Prime Minister was urged to rein in his press secretary.
Liberal Democrat MP Norman Baker used a Commons adjournment debate to call on Tony Blair to restrict the "untrammelled power" he claims has been given to Mr Campbell.



Norman Baker says Alastair Campbell's power is undermining Parliament (1'11")
"Now it is the job of Mr Blair to rein them in. If they exert uncontrolled power what this is leading to is an undermining of parliamentary democracy," Mr Baker said.
In a wide ranging attack on the Government's media relations he also accused the prime minister of conducting "an incestuous relationship" with media mogul Rupert Murdoch.
Alistair Campbell has been accused of carrying out behind-the-scenes attacks on some cabinet ministers and using his position as Mr Blair's chief spokesman to leak policy announcements to favoured journalists.
The accusations levelled against Mr Campbell and Mr Blair come after claims that Labour's media "spin doctors" attempt to intimidate journalists and have politicised the government's impartial press operations.


In the background: Mr Campbell attends cabinet meetings
One cabinet minister, Clare Short, recently claimed that some Labour figures were responsible for damaging her reputation - an attack widely believed to refer to Mr Campbell and the Minister without Portfolio, Peter Mandelson.
The two men are credited with having a major influence over government and Labour Party media operations.
Conservatives have criticised the Prime Minister for allowing Mr Campbell to attend weekly cabinet meetings.
There have also been claims that Mr Campbell has rebuked Social Security Secretary Harriet Harman for poor media performances.
Norman Baker said the fault did not lie with Mr Campbell - but with the Prime Minister.
He told the House: "The issues I raise might be batted away today and the next time and the time after that, but the Government is on a sticky wicket and are eventually going to find themselves out if they don't take action."


Harriet Harman: Tories claim Mr Campbell rebuked her
Mr Baker called for an annual report on the workings of the Downing Street press office and clarification of Mr Campbell's role.
But civil service minister Peter Kilfoyle said the government was happy with Mr Campbell's conduct.
"We are extremely pleased and he has done a good job," said Mr Kilfoyle.
"He carries out his role very effectively in accordance with the model contract for special advisors."
Mr Kilfoyle denied claims that the politically impartial press service was under Labour's control.
He claimed that Bernard Ingham, the press secretary of former Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, wielded far more power in Whitehall than Mr Campbell does.
"Mr Campbell is the government spokesman," said Mr Kilfoyle. "He has a duty to make sure that the government's message goes out."

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

dim view, on 25 April 2020 - 01:31 PM, said:

UK: Politics

Campbell attacked for 'untrammelled power'

Alastair Campbell: accused of wielding power without responsibility
Alastair Campbell is at the heart of a fresh political row after the Prime Minister was urged to rein in his press secretary.
Liberal Democrat MP Norman Baker used a Commons adjournment debate to call on Tony Blair to restrict the "untrammelled power" he claims has been given to Mr Campbell.



Norman Baker says Alastair Campbell's power is undermining Parliament (1'11")
"Now it is the job of Mr Blair to rein them in. If they exert uncontrolled power what this is leading to is an undermining of parliamentary democracy," Mr Baker said.
In a wide ranging attack on the Government's media relations he also accused the prime minister of conducting "an incestuous relationship" with media mogul Rupert Murdoch.
Alistair Campbell has been accused of carrying out behind-the-scenes attacks on some cabinet ministers and using his position as Mr Blair's chief spokesman to leak policy announcements to favoured journalists.
The accusations levelled against Mr Campbell and Mr Blair come after claims that Labour's media "spin doctors" attempt to intimidate journalists and have politicised the government's impartial press operations.


In the background: Mr Campbell attends cabinet meetings
One cabinet minister, Clare Short, recently claimed that some Labour figures were responsible for damaging her reputation - an attack widely believed to refer to Mr Campbell and the Minister without Portfolio, Peter Mandelson.
The two men are credited with having a major influence over government and Labour Party media operations.
Conservatives have criticised the Prime Minister for allowing Mr Campbell to attend weekly cabinet meetings.
There have also been claims that Mr Campbell has rebuked Social Security Secretary Harriet Harman for poor media performances.
Norman Baker said the fault did not lie with Mr Campbell - but with the Prime Minister.
He told the House: "The issues I raise might be batted away today and the next time and the time after that, but the Government is on a sticky wicket and are eventually going to find themselves out if they don't take action."


Harriet Harman: Tories claim Mr Campbell rebuked her
Mr Baker called for an annual report on the workings of the Downing Street press office and clarification of Mr Campbell's role.
But civil service minister Peter Kilfoyle said the government was happy with Mr Campbell's conduct.
"We are extremely pleased and he has done a good job," said Mr Kilfoyle.
"He carries out his role very effectively in accordance with the model contract for special advisors."
Mr Kilfoyle denied claims that the politically impartial press service was under Labour's control.
He claimed that Bernard Ingham, the press secretary of former Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, wielded far more power in Whitehall than Mr Campbell does.
"Mr Campbell is the government spokesman," said Mr Kilfoyle. "He has a duty to make sure that the government's message goes out."

So no evidence of Campbell attending SAGE meetings then, pal.

But you make a fair point about unelected advisors wielding influence as far back as the magnificently eyebrowed Bernard Ingram, Thatcher's media enforcer.

The issue still remains of one of our Brexiter friends defending exactly the kinda shady relationships so often heralded as a reason for leaving, though...

[Nerima Spireite]

https://inequality.o...e-bonanza-2020/

[plannerj]

Is the lock-down over? Must be. Here along the A6 at Rowsley the motor bikers have returned in their numbers and at high speed Lots of motorists with convertible cars passing with their tops down (ok they may be on supermarket trips) but my view is that lots of people are not taking this situation seriously. The Press clamouring for a return to “normality”. It’s time to toughen up Chief Constable. Get your clever Superintendent out with his drone again, not to pursue a couple of walkers on Curbar Edge this time, but the real culprits. If the posturing from the Government and those in power means anything, it’s time for some action.

Edit: To cap it all, car towing caravan just passed our house, heading towards Bakewell. Happy holidays!

This post has been edited by plannerj: 25 April 2020 - 03:24 PM