[The Earl of Chesterfield]

We might expect the Mirror or Guardian to feature stories critical of the government's approach. But the Telegraph? The very paper that paid Johnson over half a million pounds to peddle his fact free propaganda (a figure that so called man of the people dubbed 'chickenfeed', by the way)?

Well here's what they report today: https://www.telegrap...europe-despite/

Bozo's mob are always quick to quote the war, but it seems the Dunkirk spirit which saw countless little boats (read: small firms manufacturing PPE) assisting the big ships (read: Burberry or Barbour) has been abandoned when needed the most.

Then more lies?

https://www.msn.com/...ocid=spartanntp

But this could prove worse than all the broken promises of testing and undelivered gear: https://www.mirror.c...s-show-21900425

Most media outlets have been making it clear the official government figures are only hospital deaths for quite some time, and extrapolated out the numbers in care homes, hospices and the community at large could mean we're another Italy or Spain - despite being weeks behind their curves!

Indeed there're even suggestions some will never be counted as they simply weren't tested.

Perhaps this is just administrative delay or some other systematic failing, but the suspicious and cynical can't be blamed for wondering if someone, somewhere is trying to 'manage' statistics given so many other gaps between spin and reality...

This post has been edited by The Earl of Chesterfield: 21 April 2020 - 12:22 PM

[JonB]

mr. smith, on 21 April 2020 - 11:14 AM, said:

latest figures show 153000 out of the 1.2mill nhs staff identify as not british.
the govt have extended any permits that expire before nov for 1yr so the foreign staff can concentrate on the covid battle. not quite as appreciative as you seem to be.

Boris Johnson was particually appreciative towards the two nurses that looked after him and thanked them personally...one from Portugal and one from New Zealand!

[calvin plummers socks]

JonB, on 21 April 2020 - 12:11 PM, said:

Boris Johnson was particually appreciative towards the two nurses that looked after him and thanked them personally...one from Portugal and one from New Zealand!

Who under his and Pretty Patel’s scheme wouldn’t qualify to be in their country....

[Search & Destroy]

calvin plummers socks, on 21 April 2020 - 12:34 PM, said:

Who under his and Pretty Patel’s scheme wouldn’t qualify to be in their country....

Not sure where you get this information from

Says on the Government website that Nurses would be welcome if we need them

7. For example, a university researcher in a STEM (science, technology, engineering, and mathematics) subject wishing to come to the UK on a salary of £22,000, (which is below the general minimum salary threshold), may still be able to enter the UK if they have a relevant PhD in a STEM subject. Likewise, a nurse wishing to come to the UK on a salary of £22,000 would still be able to enter the UK on the basis that the individual would be working in a shortage occupation, provided it continues to be designated in shortage by the MAC.

[SpireiteFitzy]

calvin plummers socks, on 21 April 2020 - 04:24 AM, said:

That’s it - be nice and positive

There will be no return to normality until there is a cure. The trouble with todays society is it is so interconnected, the second you lax rules and open up travel hubs you create a 100 different ways the virus can spread again and in no time at all we'll all be back on lockdown. It'll always find a way back because people travel to all corners of the world so even if it disappears from this country your not safe and there's every chance it finds it's way back. And given how inept the screening processes for people coming into this country have been I don't trust them to be able to put into place a system that stops people infected with it arriving.

Look at interviews with scientists. They still know very little about this virus. They don't know if you can build up a resistance to it, and if you can they won't know how strong that resistance is, whether the virus can lie dormant in a resistant person and therefore still be spread. It could mutate and become even worse.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search and Destroy, on 21 April 2020 - 12:46 PM, said:

Not sure where you get this information from

Says on the Government website that Nurses would be welcome if we need them

7. For example, a university researcher in a STEM (science, technology, engineering, and mathematics) subject wishing to come to the UK on a salary of £22,000, (which is below the general minimum salary threshold), may still be able to enter the UK if they have a relevant PhD in a STEM subject. Likewise, a nurse wishing to come to the UK on a salary of £22,000 would still be able to enter the UK on the basis that the individual would be working in a shortage occupation, provided it continues to be designated in shortage by the MAC.

Here y'go: https://www.independ...t-a9343571.html

And any chance of answering what I asked? Why your government's figures are worse than so many other countries if they're 'just following advice from the science' (post #1308)? If you join me in advocating an across the board approach to addressing a debt similar to the one incurred during the worldwide economic crash? In denying those advocating public service cuts to fund tax cuts (post #1353)? Applauding ALL those currently underpinning society, regardless of role or background (post #1357)?

'Cos if not it might look like you're using this crisis to pursue some twisted agenda which someone recently described as 'low'...

[Search & Destroy]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 21 April 2020 - 01:10 PM, said:

Here y'go: https://www.independ...t-a9343571.html

And any chance of answering what I asked? Why your government's figures are worse than so many other countries if they're 'just following advice from the science' (post #1308)? If you join me in advocating an across the board approach to addressing a debt similar to the one incurred during the worldwide economic crash? In denying those advocating public service cuts to fund tax cuts (post #1353)? Applauding ALL those currently underpinning society, regardless of role or background (post #1357)?

'Cos if not it might look like you're using this crisis to pursue some twisted agenda which someone recently described as 'low'...

Someone said the nurse from NZ wouldn’t be allowed in so I fact checked it

We are talking about nurses pal and you send me a link to something completely unrelated, Not even tenuously related

The Government website says nurses are welcome if we have the need

I do not know why our figures are worse than some others, If pressed I’d say density of population, crowded transport hubs, that’s maybe why London is hard hit and places like the south west aren’t, aged population?

Yes to your other points, not sure about the debt, stuff like HS2, cancel it or speculate to accumulate?

Happy to pay a bit more tax if EVERYONE else does, although I pay loads anyway

[calvin plummers socks]

Search and Destroy, on 21 April 2020 - 01:36 PM, said:

Someone said the nurse from NZ wouldn’t be allowed in so I fact checked it

We are talking about nurses pal and you send me a link to something completely unrelated, Not even tenuously related

The Government website says nurses are welcome if we have the need

I do not know why our figures are worse than some others, If pressed I’d say density of population, crowded transport hubs, that’s maybe why London is hard hit and places like the south west aren’t, aged population?

Yes to your other points, not sure about the debt, stuff like HS2, cancel it or speculate to accumulate?

Happy to pay a bit more tax if EVERYONE else does, although I pay loads anyway

The primary reason in London is probably the tube at this stage. Reduced service = more crowded trains (although a lot quieter than a couple of weeks ago)

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search and Destroy, on 21 April 2020 - 01:36 PM, said:

Someone said the nurse from NZ wouldn’t be allowed in so I fact checked it

We are talking about nurses pal and you send me a link to something completely unrelated, Not even tenuously related

The Government website says nurses are welcome if we have the need

I do not know why our figures are worse than some others, If pressed I’d say density of population, crowded transport hubs, that’s maybe why London is hard hit and places like the south west aren’t, aged population?

Yes to your other points, not sure about the debt, stuff like HS2, cancel it or speculate to accumulate?

Happy to pay a bit more tax if EVERYONE else does, although I pay loads anyway

You're right about the link. Sorry, misunderstood and thought Patel's folks being denied entry was referenced (doh!).

Does kinda speak to the mixed-up and often dog whistle immigration policies being so obviously exposed at the moment, though. How many of those 'Australian style' points did Bozo's saviours have - do you know? Does Bozo? Does anyone?

For what it's worth I'm writing this sat in my back garden with some sort of Asian/Arabic sounds drifting over my fence. Which yesterday was Polish. Which the day before was Peak chuffin' FM.

None of it's a patch on the 'Northern' I belt out of course, but my point is it's all just music...in't it?

This post has been edited by The Earl of Chesterfield: 21 April 2020 - 02:43 PM

[calvin plummers socks]

SpireiteFitzy, on 21 April 2020 - 12:50 PM, said:

There will be no return to normality until there is a cure. The trouble with todays society is it is so interconnected, the second you lax rules and open up travel hubs you create a 100 different ways the virus can spread again and in no time at all we'll all be back on lockdown. It'll always find a way back because people travel to all corners of the world so even if it disappears from this country your not safe and there's every chance it finds it's way back. And given how inept the screening processes for people coming into this country have been I don't trust them to be able to put into place a system that stops people infected with it arriving.

Not sure I agree with this as there are other diseases without a cure that are contagious.
The world simply can’t continue to be locked down -it can’t afford to so ‘normality’ will happen sooner rather than later

[Mr Mercury]

Mr Mercury, on 18 April 2020 - 10:36 PM, said:

Last week I ordered two lots of ten reusable face masks, one off eBay, one from Amazon, both for around £10. Not to try and horde or take supplies from the NHS, which should have first call on ANY PPE going, but purely because I can see the wearing of such protection becoming common place/advised/mandatory...etc in confined indoor spaces such as shops, supermarkets, public transport etc and I've no idea how the government are going to provide the protection, either free of charge or for a fee to the majority of the population.
One lot is due last week in April, the other first week of May. Time will tell whether I get them or I'm refunded or just been conned.

Well the lot that were due last week in April arrived today, I certainly don't think they'd suffice to be worn on the front line as such, but as a mask to be worn on public transport or going into shops, if that becomes the requirement, then they seem perfectly acceptable.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Mr Mercury, on 21 April 2020 - 03:19 PM, said:

Well the lot that were due last week in April arrived today, I certainly don't think they'd suffice to be worn on the front line as such, but as a mask to be worn on public transport or going into shops, if that becomes the requirement, then they seem perfectly acceptable.

Given the latest 'mixed messages' from government - a top man saying the decision not to join the EU procurement scheme was political rather than any e-mail mix up, only for Hancock to claim we ARE in the scheme - I reckon they should put you in charge of getting stuff, pal.

[Mr Mercury]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 21 April 2020 - 05:22 PM, said:

Given the latest 'mixed messages' from government - a top man saying the decision not to join the EU procurement scheme was political rather than any e-mail mix up, only for Hancock to claim we ARE in the scheme - I reckon they should put you in charge of getting stuff, pal.

I've not got the second box yet! I'll keep you posted...

[azul]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 21 April 2020 - 05:22 PM, said:

Given the latest 'mixed messages' from government - a top man saying the decision not to join the EU procurement scheme was political rather than any e-mail mix up, only for Hancock to claim we ARE in the scheme - I reckon they should put you in charge of getting stuff, pal.

Me, me, me

I bought some masks (and alcoholic wet wipes) at the start of February, thinking I was flying into a danger zone in late March.

If they had me in charge back than we’d have no problems, we’d be exporting PPE

[isleaiw1]

To put some perspective on PPE an acquaintance works for a logistics company - normally manufacturing stuff but well, there isn’t as much need moving now so he has been assigned to looking after their fleet of lorries delivering the stuff into ‘ our of a brand new dedicated warehousing facility specifically for NHS PPE. He was saying that last week they were getting part loads in but now it’s full wagons of stuff from each source.

To put some perspective on volumes, they got 140,000 gowns from Myanmar - sounds a lot till you realise that someone in the NHS reckons they would get through 150,000 units a DAY if at full capacity.

[azul]

isleaiw1, on 21 April 2020 - 06:25 PM, said:

To put some perspective on PPE an acquaintance works for a logistics company - normally manufacturing stuff but well, there isn’t as much need moving now so he has been assigned to looking after their fleet of lorries delivering the stuff into ‘ our of a brand new dedicated warehousing facility specifically for NHS PPE. He was saying that last week they were getting part loads in but now it’s full wagons of stuff from each source.

To put some perspective on volumes, they got 140,000 gowns from Myanmar - sounds a lot till you realise that someone in the NHS reckons they would get through 150,000 units a DAY if at full capacity.

‘Wagons full of stuff ’ available? That’s good news.

Meanwhile they sent a Military Aircraft to Turkey to hopefully pick up 80 tons of ‘stuff’

Either it was a PR stunt from your mate Alexander Boris de Pfaffel Johnson (aka Bozza) or your acquaintance is not what he seems?

This post has been edited by azul: 21 April 2020 - 07:02 PM

[SpireiteFitzy]

calvin plummers socks, on 21 April 2020 - 02:17 PM, said:

Not sure I agree with this as there are other diseases without a cure that are contagious.
The world simply can’t continue to be locked down -it can’t afford to so ‘normality’ will happen sooner rather than later

And how many of them other diseases have shut down the entire world as you put it?

The world cannot afford to rush back to how things used to be and suffer a second outbreak. The world is shut down for less time by treating one outbreak properly than risking a second one. We live in a country of 66 million people and less than half a million have been given a test to see if they have or are carrying this virus, and even if the government gets to it's 100,000 a day target up until mid june your talking still less than 10 million getting tested. So you'd just let 50 million people out who've no idea if they have it or are carrying it and able to pass it on?

Unless there is mass testing with huge parts of the population sure they aren't at risk of this or you have a vaccine available en masse for anyone who does catch it post quarentine then your just asking for a second outbreak.

[Mr Mercury]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 21 April 2020 - 05:22 PM, said:

Given the latest 'mixed messages' from government - a top man saying the decision not to join the EU procurement scheme was political rather than any e-mail mix up, only for Hancock to claim we ARE in the scheme - I reckon they should put you in charge of getting stuff, pal.

Claim and counter claim..
Coronavirus: Top civil servant Sir Simon McDonald withdraws claim UK 'chose' not to join EU medical kit scheme
http://news.sky.com/...scheme-11976778

[isleaiw1]

azul, on 21 April 2020 - 06:49 PM, said:

‘Wagons full of stuff ’ available? That’s good news.

Meanwhile they sent a Military Aircraft to Turkey to hopefully pick up 80 tons of ‘stuff’

Either it was a PR stunt from your mate Alexander Boris de Pfaffel Johnson (aka Bozza) or your acquaintance is not what he seems?

I think they may be sourcing stuff from more than one place, surprisingly

84 tons, about 3 to 4 lorry loads. You dont need a specialist warehousing facility if that is all you are getting. Could probably handle that through NHS logistics own facilities. So I suspect that they are getting a LOT more than 84 tons in total, and NHS logistics and supply chain is overwhelmed.

[Wooden Spoon]

Mr Mercury said:

1587501346[/url]' post='1515412']
Claim and counter claim..
Coronavirus: Top civil servant Sir Simon McDonald withdraws claim UK 'chose' not to join EU medical kit scheme
http://news.sky.com/...scheme-11976778

I read today that the EU scheme has yet to deliver any items to anyone, so whether we joined or not first time around seems to be a moot point.




The UK did join for “the second round”.