[azul]

isleaiw1, on 14 April 2020 - 03:13 PM, said:

Osbourne is more critical of anyone who has come after than any Labour politician ever has been, you would think he was bitter at being ousted....

Couldnt the EU insist the order was placed and bill member states? they seem to with other things...

I know, but let’s face it, his ouster has been ousted so he should be onside again - anyway his paper isn’t exactly neutral.

This post has been edited by azul: 14 April 2020 - 03:53 PM

[azul]

CFC91, on 14 April 2020 - 03:27 PM, said:

NHS field hospital has no patients or staff
Video content

Video caption: Inside Nightingale Hospital BirminghamInside Nightingale Hospital Birmingham
A field hospital built to help the UK cope with coronavirus currently has no patients or staff, the BBC has learned.

Work on the NHS Birmingham Nightingale Hospital was completed last week, but the facility - which has 500 beds and capacity for 1,000 more - stands empty.

A spokesperson for NHS England said that they were not staffing the temporary facility because the 23 local hospitals that feed into it haven’t needed to use it.

They added that the Nightingale can be opened and staffed with 24-48 hours notice, should the situation change.

A medic in the West Midlands told the BBC: “Birmingham Nightingale has stood down for the moment. Medics have been told not to come to Nightingale as of yesterday and will be called upon when needed.”

The Midlands is the second worst hit NHS Trust area in the UK.

More than 2,000 deaths have been reported in the region - more than anywhere except London.

Several temporary field hospitals have been created around the UK in response to coronavirus. This map plots some of their locations


Surely our £££ would have been better invested elsewhere in the short term?

That maybe the case but it was/is an insurance policy.

If you looked at the pictures from America and China where they had these mega facilities, I don’t think I saw patients in any of them. Cynics would probably say they look on TV

[azul]

Search and Destroy, on 14 April 2020 - 03:18 PM, said:

Would have been 30% cost to Germany and UK, 20% to France and then 20% between the other 24 if it’s true to form

Maybe aye, maybes no

The report did suggest that each individual country submitted their order and the EU would procure it in one go, therefore getting a better deal. Our resident businessman should be able to confirm the advantage of the ‘economy of scale’

There was no suggestion that it was to be centrally funded, otherwise we’d be in for our share.

[Mr Mercury]

CFC91, on 14 April 2020 - 03:27 PM, said:

NHS field hospital has no patients or staff
Video content

Video caption: Inside Nightingale Hospital BirminghamInside Nightingale Hospital Birmingham
A field hospital built to help the UK cope with coronavirus currently has no patients or staff, the BBC has learned.

Work on the NHS Birmingham Nightingale Hospital was completed last week, but the facility - which has 500 beds and capacity for 1,000 more - stands empty.

A spokesperson for NHS England said that they were not staffing the temporary facility because the 23 local hospitals that feed into it haven’t needed to use it.

They added that the Nightingale can be opened and staffed with 24-48 hours notice, should the situation change.

A medic in the West Midlands told the BBC: “Birmingham Nightingale has stood down for the moment. Medics have been told not to come to Nightingale as of yesterday and will be called upon when needed.”

The Midlands is the second worst hit NHS Trust area in the UK.

More than 2,000 deaths have been reported in the region - more than anywhere except London.

Several temporary field hospitals have been created around the UK in response to coronavirus. This map plots some of their locations


Surely our £££ would have been better invested elsewhere in the short term?

People cant criticise the government for not being ready in some areas, quite rightly in many cases, then criticise them when they do seem to have got some of the pre planning right.

[Search & Destroy]

Mr Mercury, on 14 April 2020 - 03:57 PM, said:

People cant criticise the government for not being ready in some areas, quite rightly in many cases, then criticise them when they do seem to have got some of the pre planning right.

Oh but they can and they do

It’s called Corona hindsight syndrome

[Wooden Spoon]

CFC91 said:

1586878030[/url]' post='1514410']
NHS field hospital has no patients or staff
Video content

Video caption: Inside Nightingale Hospital BirminghamInside Nightingale Hospital Birmingham
A field hospital built to help the UK cope with coronavirus currently has no patients or staff, the BBC has learned.

Work on the NHS Birmingham Nightingale Hospital was completed last week, but the facility - which has 500 beds and capacity for 1,000 more - stands empty.

A spokesperson for NHS England said that they were not staffing the temporary facility because the 23 local hospitals that feed into it haven't needed to use it.

They added that the Nightingale can be opened and staffed with 24-48 hours notice, should the situation change.

A medic in the West Midlands told the BBC: "Birmingham Nightingale has stood down for the moment. Medics have been told not to come to Nightingale as of yesterday and will be called upon when needed."

The Midlands is the second worst hit NHS Trust area in the UK.

More than 2,000 deaths have been reported in the region - more than anywhere except London.

Several temporary field hospitals have been created around the UK in response to coronavirus. This map plots some of their locations


Surely our £££ would have been better invested elsewhere in the short term?

Surely the nightingale hospitals being empty is a good thing?





Honestly some of the stuff being said here is daft. Just plain daft criticism for the sake of criticism.




Why aren’t the rich using private beds to free up nhs (they’ve been bought up by the nhs) while criticising the wealthy for having private health care.




Why aren’t the rich using private ICU beds (when non exist) while criticism of private healthcare healthcare




Why are they wasting money on the emergency units when they are not being used, yet criticised them for for not doing enough and relying on herd immunity?





Why didn’t we sign up for PPE from the EU, when at the time thenEU has shortages and we’re stopping shipments at nation states borders?




It’s just criticism for the sake of it because you don’t like the tories.




The tories have made mistakes, not locking down soon enough, not testing and tracing, still not testing enough. Poor distribution and poor procurement of PPE. Non testing early on of health care workers. Non reporting and supply of PPE for care homes. There’s enough to bash the tories on without making stuff up.






A slight off tangent snippet - economy is due to shrink by 35% by June. That’s astonishing. Who’s gonna pay for it? Hopefully not those who’ve carried the nation at this time, like checkout staff, shelf stackers, delivery drivers etc.

[mr. smith]

Search and Destroy, on 14 April 2020 - 04:22 PM, said:

Oh but they can and they do

It’s called Corona hindsight syndrome

I think you got a mild dose of it in this thread

[Wooden Spoon]

mr. smith said:

1586881884[/url]' post='1514421']
I think you got a mild dose of it in this thread

Everyone has to some degree or other. It’s a lack of objectivity that I’m finding annoying

[azul]

DEATH, on 14 April 2020 - 04:31 PM, said:

Surely the nightingale hospitals being empty is a good thing]

A slight off tangent snippet - economy is due to shrink by 35% by June. That’s astonishing. Who’s gonna pay for it? Hopefully not those who’ve carried the nation at this time, like checkout staff, shelf stackers, delivery drivers etc.

I think you have answered you’re own question

Or do you think it will Rees-Mogg’s Investment Company?

[calvin plummers socks]

Figures of deaths seems to have plateaued out thankfully

April
5 - 621
6 - 439
7 - 786
8 - 938
9 - 881
10 - 980 (highest)
11 - 917
12 - 737
13 - 717
14 - 779

Only hospital figures but the trend will be similar in the outside world
Lockdown effect coming into place about now

[Wooden Spoon]

...

This post has been edited by DEATH: 14 April 2020 - 05:09 PM

[Wooden Spoon]

calvin plummers socks said:

1586883935[/url]' post='1514426']
Figures of deaths seems to have plateaued out thankfully

April
5 - 621
6 - 439
7 - 786
8 - 938
9 - 881
10 - 980 (highest)
11 - 917
12 - 737
13 - 717
14 - 779

Only hospital figures but the trend will be similar in the outside world
Lockdown effect coming into place about now

Yeah, thankfully it looks like it.




I hope that any release measures are controlled, and not done too early - we don’t want another spike and a second phase of lock down measures.

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search and Destroy, on 14 April 2020 - 04:22 PM, said:

Oh but they can and they do

It’s called Corona hindsight syndrome

But it's not 'hindsight', is it.

You quoted 'us' being ten days behind Italy and inferior to Japan in your very first post. So even by your own admission the government had time to look and learn.

It's also a matter of record that Johnson and Co were still allowing mass gatherings whilst many others were locking down.

Please be my guest to go through the thread post by post to see who called that out and who resorted to racism. Or diversion. Or hypocrisy.

By the way, I see Sky News are now reporting the number of HOSPITAL deaths instead of a gross total. Meanwhile the Sun's Tom Newton-Dunn (that's the SUN, by the way) pointed out our numbers have been higher than France's if we include non hospital fatalities.

Be interesting to know why government graphs featured all the deceased abroad but not all the UK ones. Infact almost the kinda stunt some have accused the Chinese of...

[Wooden Spoon]

Hats off to Tom Moore.




Raised over £2,500,000.




Brilliant.

[CFC91]

DEATH, on 14 April 2020 - 04:31 PM, said:

Surely the nightingale hospitals being empty is a good thing?





Honestly some of the stuff being said here is daft. Just plain daft criticism for the sake of criticism.




Why aren’t the rich using private beds to free up nhs (they’ve been bought up by the nhs) while criticising the wealthy for having private health care.




Why aren’t the rich using private ICU beds (when non exist) while criticism of private healthcare healthcare




Why are they wasting money on the emergency units when they are not being used, yet criticised them for for not doing enough and relying on herd immunity?





Why didn’t we sign up for PPE from the EU, when at the time thenEU has shortages and we’re stopping shipments at nation states borders?




It’s just criticism for the sake of it because you don’t like the tories.




The tories have made mistakes, not locking down soon enough, not testing and tracing, still not testing enough. Poor distribution and poor procurement of PPE. Non testing early on of health care workers. Non reporting and supply of PPE for care homes. There’s enough to bash the tories on without making stuff up.






A slight off tangent snippet - economy is due to shrink by 35% by June. That’s astonishing. Who’s gonna pay for it? Hopefully not those who’ve carried the nation at this time, like checkout staff, shelf stackers, delivery drivers etc.

Quite how you’ve jumped to that conclusion from posing a question I’ve no idea. Jumped the gun a little bit and gone off on a bit of a tangent over nothing here.

It wasn’t a criticism it was more in response to the debate on this very thread about the London Nightingale hospital also being practically empty.

If we are due to peak on the 17th April like the CMO and others have predicted then likely these have been built when maybe not even needed.

And we aren’t prepared - watch the news and look at the state of the hospitals and staff on the front line, or look at the mess happening in our care homes. This is an issue right here and now.

My cousins a nurse at Calow, been diagnosed and infected her entire close family it looks like. Probably preventable all said and done. I’d still rather the money we do have is spent on fires burning now, not trying to stop one igniting 2 weeks down the line. Hence my question

As for who’s going to it for it. We al will, and rightly so. Self employed and all.

This post has been edited by CFC91: 14 April 2020 - 05:48 PM

[CFC91]

DEATH, on 14 April 2020 - 05:35 PM, said:

Hats off to Tom Moore.




Raised over £2,500,000.




Brilliant.

Well done that man. Was at 800k when he on GMB this morning so looks like Piers Morgan and cos appeal has worked

[Wooden Spoon]

Former FA chairman David Bernstein calling for the government to appoint an outside, independent regulatory body to govern football. “Football can’t/won’t run itself properly”

[Wooden Spoon]

CFC91 said:

1586886173[/url]' post='1514436']
watch the news and look at the state of the hospitals and staff on the front line, or look at the mess happening in our care homes. This is an issue right here and now.

Maybe we need to use them, to release beds in local NHS hospitals for the care homes?

[Search & Destroy]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 14 April 2020 - 05:20 PM, said:

But it's not 'hindsight', is it.

You quoted 'us' being ten days behind Italy and inferior to Japan in your very first post. So even by your own admission the government had time to look and learn.

It's also a matter of record that Johnson and Co were still allowing mass gatherings whilst many others were locking down.

Please be my guest to go through the thread post by post to see who called that out and who resorted to racism. Or diversion. Or hypocrisy.

By the way, I see Sky News are now reporting the number of HOSPITAL deaths instead of a gross total. Meanwhile the Sun's Tom Newton-Dunn (that's the SUN, by the way) pointed out our numbers have been higher than France's if we include non hospital fatalities.

Be interesting to know why government graphs featured all the deceased abroad but not all the UK ones. Infact almost the kinda stunt some have accused the Chinese of...

Of course it’s hindsight when reacting to a post saying the Nightingale Hospitals haven’t been used and the money could have been better spent elsewhere

Yes we have always been 10 days behind Italy and as it stands we have just over half as many deaths at 11000, tens days ago on the 4th April Italy were at 15000 so we are doing better in that respect

I don’t disagree that a ban on mass gatherings should have come earlier, but I’m no virologist and the scientists said herd immunity was the way to go (before quickly changing their minds)

How do other countries count care home deaths?

Coronavirus: the week explained - sign up for our email newsletter
Read more
We cannot directly compare care home deaths in the UK with those in other countries as there are a range of different ways of recording these deaths.

In Ireland, France and Germany, official data on deaths includes those in care settings. Of Irish deaths which occurred up until 11 April, 54% had occurred in care homes, according to the country’s chief medical officer. Figures released by the French public health authority show 45% of deaths took place in care homes.

Italy and Spain by contrast do not report deaths in care settings regularly. In Italy, best estimates were based on a survey of 10% of care homes in the country. The death rate in this sample was extrapolated to reach an estimate for all care homes, which suggests 53% of coronavirus deaths were happening in care. In Spain, estimates based on regional totals submitted to the government also suggest those in nursing homes accounted for more than half of deaths.

Italy and Spain report the same as us, comparing us with China....borderline pathetic

[azul]

calvin plummers socks, on 14 April 2020 - 05:05 PM, said:

Figures of deaths seems to have plateaued out thankfully

April
5 - 621
6 - 439
7 - 786
8 - 938
9 - 881
10 - 980 (highest)
11 - 917
12 - 737
13 - 717
14 - 779

Only hospital figures but the trend will be similar in the outside world
Lockdown effect coming into place about now

The next few days will be telling. It’s well documented that weekend figures are lower due to reporting mechanisms and that can been seen in your figures. Surely to god, after 3 weeks of lockdown we’ll start to see a plateau and then a drop off, as seems to be happening elsewhere.