[isleaiw1]

Goku, on 12 April 2020 - 01:50 PM, said:

1. If Corbyn had been in charge and had done the exact same steps as this Government has he would be getting destroyed
2. Great last line - don’t criticise because you don’t do their job lol. 5* 200 IQ big brained comment

Its easy to criticise and much harder to do - and only those who never have to make real big decisions would sit here criticising those that have to. Its not perfect, no govts treatment will be. I would have done some things different, but thankfully I dont have thousands of lives in my hands and a bunch of sofa PMs reckoning they could do better.

My IQs OK thanks, as is my common sense.

[Goku]

Obviously people can critique based on the information available to them, not everybody has to be a bootlicker

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

I'd remind everyone that the Brown government faced a similar worldwide catastrophe in '08, applied similar economic solutions, yet've spent the last ten years being crucified for it.

Mostly by those now defending and applauding Johnson's mob.

And it's funny how those blaming them for not doing enough to see the crash coming - some of whom were advocating FEWER financial regulations at the time - are quick to dismiss the ten years of public service underfunding that're exacerbating the current epidemic.

As our friend 'Goku' quite rightly points out, one set of standards for the Left but an entirely different set for the Right...

This post has been edited by The Earl of Chesterfield: 12 April 2020 - 02:32 PM

[Search & Destroy]

fishini, on 11 April 2020 - 01:43 PM, said:

How can anyone justify his posts? If I'm supposed to be a xenophobe what is he?

Jeez if people are comparing me with you I’ve really gone too far...

Fantastic, inspiration speech by the PM a few minutes ago, brought a tear to my eye.

No of us really knows what’s going on with this PPE but I’m sure Boris is straining every sinew to do whatever is possible

[mr. smith]

isleaiw1, on 12 April 2020 - 02:09 PM, said:

Its easy to criticise and much harder to do - and only those who never have to make real big decisions would sit here criticising those that have to. Its not perfect, no govts treatment will be. I would have done some things different, but thankfully I dont have thousands of lives in my hands and a bunch of sofa PMs reckoning they could do better.

My IQs OK thanks, as is my common sense.

obv youre not a sofa pm then.
I bow to your superior knowledge

[Wooden Spoon]

Goku said:

1586699444[/url]' post='1514207']
1. If Corbyn had been in charge and had done the exact same steps as this Government has he would be getting destroyed
2. Great last line - don't criticise because you don't do their job lol. 5* 200 IQ big brained comment

Dunno if they would HB. TBH if the likes of Abbott had managed to devise sensible policies to try to help workers and the economy, while delivering it in a similar coherent manner such as the 80% thing I think most would have pleasantly surprised they showed common sense and some competence. And congratulated accordingly.





Criticism over testing is valid. South Korea showed the way, test, traces more tests more traces. Honestly I don’t know what the deal is with testing, and lack of. I need to do a bit of reading I think.





Criticism, and even now,on going criticism over testing, and more crucially IMO, the PPE problem is valid, more than valid. Fair enough, I get the reason they don’t have warehouse after warehouse rammed full of masks. And fair enough, I’m willing to give some slack over a temporary shortage until production catches demand. So why then, a couple of weeks after government ministers are saying we’ve millions of them, they’ve been ordered/delivered/ in transit etc, are we seeing stories of medical staff using bin bags as aprons? This is not the time for lies and political evasion.




I’d have much more respect if they said yep, were short. We’re really trying to get the stuff, we’ve got Burberry online now and others, and we’re so sorry for our medics but for a few days we’re just gonna have to try to made the best of it. Sorry, we were behind the curve and didn’t realise what the demand for PPE would be.





I still maintain though the true test, the true colours of this government will be seen in the “post Covid-19” world. The time to judge will be then.

[azul]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 12 April 2020 - 02:28 PM, said:

I'd remind everyone that the Brown government faced a similar worldwide catastrophe in '08, applied similar economic solutions, yet've spent the last ten years being crucified for it.

Mostly by those now defending and applauding Johnson's mob.

And it's funny how those blaming them for not doing enough to see the crash coming - some of whom were advocating FEWER financial regulations at the time - are quick to dismiss the ten years of public service underfunding that're exacerbating the current epidemic.

As our friend 'Goku' quite rightly points out, one set of standards for the Left but an entirely different set for the Right...

Great post

I have been thinking of bringing this subject for a while bu you’ve done it more eloquently than I could manage.

I was watching the CNN business show and they were comparing the financial implications of 2008 and 2020. About the only thing they agreed about was the lack of world leadership today compared with 2008 and guess whose name came up more than once in a very complimentary way - Gordon Brown

Now I have to confess, I wasn’t very happy about the way he mobilised the world into pouring public money into bailing out the corrupt banking system. Just goes to show how lefties can see past party politics and criticise their own side. Probably why they don’t do so well at the ballot box as the right.

[mr. smith]

Search and Destroy, on 12 April 2020 - 02:42 PM, said:

Jeez if people are comparing me with you I’ve really gone too far...

Fantastic, inspiration speech by the PM a few minutes ago, brought a tear to my eye.

No of us really knows what’s going on with this PPE but I’m sure Boris is straining every sinew to do whatever is possible

we haven't got enough of it & after lying about it ministers are now just avoiding the questions or trying to blame the nhs staff for misuse. whatever the hue of govt this cant be right

[Wooden Spoon]

The Earl of Chesterfield said:

1586701727[/url]' post='1514211']
I'd remind everyone that the Brown government faced a similar worldwide catastrophe in '08, applied similar economic solutions, yet've spent the last ten years being crucified for it.

Mostly by those now defending and applauding Johnson's mob.

And it's funny how those blaming them for not doing enough to see the crash coming - some of whom were advocating FEWER financial regulations at the time - are quick to dismiss the ten years of public service underfunding that're exacerbating the current epidemic.

As our friend 'Goku' quite rightly points out, one set of standards for the Left but an entirely different set for the Right...

Brown did what had to be done, and in many ways, his actions led the way with other Central Banks following his actions. No criticism over that from me. If there is something to criticise from that era, it was the the loosening of banking regulations that led to them taking more risks and gambling with other people’s money.




IMO we need to compare Ireland and the UK.




Ireland didn’t implement austerity measures. They implemented draconian cuts to services that made austerity look like a spending spree.




With the benefit of hindsight, it was perhaps the better policy because instead of 10 years of austerity, of public pay freezes and cuts to services they had a couple of years of pain, followed by a few years of slow recovery. Almost the opposite of what Cameron and May brought to the table.

[Wooden Spoon]

Search and Destroy said:

1586702570[/url]' post='1514212']

Fantastic, inspiration speech by the PM a few minutes ago, brought a tear to my eye.

That’s the problem though. He’s a great speaker.





Don’t just go on what he says, also judge him on what he does, and doesn’t do. Just going on speeches allows him to use his floppy hair, his enthusiasm, his persona to bumble and bluff his way out of it.





I just hope his desire to be popular, his desire to be a celebrated public figure will be the one thing that holds his feet to the fire.

[isleaiw1]

The Earl of Chesterfield, on 12 April 2020 - 02:28 PM, said:

I'd remind everyone that the Brown government faced a similar worldwide catastrophe in '08, applied similar economic solutions, yet've spent the last ten years being crucified for it.

Mostly by those now defending and applauding Johnson's mob.

And it's funny how those blaming them for not doing enough to see the crash coming - some of whom were advocating FEWER financial regulations at the time - are quick to dismiss the ten years of public service underfunding that're exacerbating the current epidemic.

As our friend 'Goku' quite rightly points out, one set of standards for the Left but an entirely different set for the Right...

No criticism from meabout how he dealt with the crisis - my criticism was that he was always saying he was getting rid of boom and bust whilst p***ing money up the wall in the good years, making the bust even bigger when it came.

I see a lot of similarity between BoJo and Blair - talk a great game, do what pleases people at the time but its about politics not long term success...

[isleaiw1]

mr. smith, on 12 April 2020 - 02:43 PM, said:

obv youre not a sofa pm then.
I bow to your superior knowledge

The difference is I am not criticising, and wont be crucified if my decisions are wrong.

But its ok, i know you lot know better...

[isleaiw1]

DEATH, on 12 April 2020 - 03:24 PM, said:

Brown did what had to be done, and in many ways, his actions led the way with other Central Banks following his actions. No criticism over that from me. If there is something to criticise from that era, it was the the loosening of banking regulations that led to them taking more risks and gambling with other people’s money.




IMO we need to compare Ireland and the UK.




Ireland didn’t implement austerity measures. They implemented draconian cuts to services that made austerity look like a spending spree.




With the benefit of hindsight, it was perhaps the better policy because instead of 10 years of austerity, of public pay freezes and cuts to services they had a couple of years of pain, followed by a few years of slow recovery. Almost the opposite of what Cameron and May brought to the table.

A couple of years of pain...a slight understatement. I wasin a taxi to Dublin airport in 2012, and got talking to the driver. He was telling me how he was a Finance Director of a small business when the crisis came - lost his job, couldnt get another, and took to taxi driving to earn a crust and retain his dignity. He and his family never recovered - and according to him there were many like him...

[mr. smith]

isleaiw1, on 12 April 2020 - 03:40 PM, said:

The difference is I am not criticising, and wont be crucified if my decisions are wrong.

But its ok, i know you lot know better...

no youre not criticising youll just sit there & be wise after the event.
theyre politicians we are talking about not salvation army volunteers. if decisions are made with the best intentions & based on the best info then I don't think anyone will be crucified. equally if they aren't then rightly people will be hung out to dry.

[Goku]

azul, on 12 April 2020 - 03:05 PM, said:

Now I have to confess, I wasn’t very happy about the way he mobilised the world into pouring public money into bailing out the corrupt banking system. Just goes to show how lefties can see past party politics and criticise their own side. Probably why they don’t do so well at the ballot box as the right.

Great point and one I’ve thought for a while. The right has minimal levels of introspection.

[Goku]

DEATH, on 12 April 2020 - 02:59 PM, said:

Dunno if they would HB. TBH if the likes of Abbott had managed to devise sensible policies to try to help workers and the economy, while delivering it in a similar coherent manner such as the 80% thing I think most would have pleasantly surprised they showed common sense and some competence. And congratulated accordingly.

You think Corbyn and Abbott would get any credit whatsoever from anybody who didn’t already support them? I’d be incredibly surprised. Agree with the rest of your post though, just once it’d be nice to have a bit of honesty. I actually appreciated when BoJo said people will die, it’s obvious but just tell the truth.

[Search & Destroy]

Considering that we haven’t been over capacity yet for ventilators, it’s fair to say that however this was handled it’d be the same result

We have a small, crowded island and this virus has no cure and it spreads easily

The worry is that we have about 70000 confirmed cases, let’s assume many more have had it and aren’t counted, if 100x the confirmed cases have had it that’s 7 million

The reality is that another 53 million can still catch it and hundreds of thousands could die

I think it was Goku who suggested bring it on and thin the herd

I think that’s what’s gonna happen

[The Earl of Chesterfield]

Search and Destroy, on 12 April 2020 - 05:52 PM, said:

Considering that we haven’t been over capacity yet for ventilators, it’s fair to say that however this was handled it’d be the same result

We have a small, crowded island and this virus has no cure and it spreads easily

The worry is that we have about 70000 confirmed cases, let’s assume many more have had it and aren’t counted, if 100x the confirmed cases have had it that’s 7 million

The reality is that another 53 million can still catch it and hundreds of thousands could die

I think it was Goku who suggested bring it on and thin the herd

I think that’s what’s gonna happen

Is that true? Only eight(ish) thousand of the tens of thousands of Covid patients have needed a ventilator at any given time? Not a single clinician has been forced to make tragic triage choices?

That's really remarkable, and in stark contrast to us having the fastest daily death rise in Europe...

[Search & Destroy]

It’s what’s been reported, everyone who needed a ventilator has had access to one

[isleaiw1]

Search and Destroy, on 12 April 2020 - 06:49 PM, said:

It’s what’s been reported, everyone who needed a ventilator has had access to one

well in London which was the worst hit part of the UK, they managed to put back utilising the Nightingale hospital because the need hadnt arisen. And still using a fraction of the capacity it has.