[Mr Mercury]

Walton Spireite, on 14 April 2014 - 07:41 PM, said:

Get rid far too expensive

That's the actual gist of the thread..folk realise, and possibly Hird as well, that his last deal was a once in a career deal...but his versatility and general competence would be well worth it next season, in League One, if a reduced offer was tabled and accepted!

[Phil V 72]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Amazing how everybody looks good when we win. Hird has been played at CH dozens of times and hasn't made the grade - he isn't likely to do any better at a higher level.
It may be the case that PC is playing him in the midfield with a view to offering another contract. He's probably OK away from home, in the absence of Ryan, to stiffen up the defence a bit, but in home games when we're likely to be playing a packed defence his lack of creativity rules him out - he's not the bloke to un-pick a tight defence.
I wouldn't be too concerned to see him re-sign on that basis for something a lot less than he's presumably on now, but there will be are a lot of decent players out there looking for a job. We should aim higher than somebody who hasn't commanded a regular spot in L2.
Personally I'd rather keep Togwell, but he doesn't seem to be the flavour of the month.

Wasn't Hird in central defence for the first 10 games or so, plus didn't he also play for Donny in The Championship?

He may not have met expectations but to say he hasn't made the grade is a little harsh.

[Sabreman]

Hird was superb for the first ten or so games before Cooky wrongly shoehorned Evatt into the side dropping Hird to the bench. He was transfer listed but has shown fantastic character, for me I hope we sign him up a very versatile player who can play in a number of positions, has never let us down in my opinion. A really top pro who deserves a contract offer, I doubt he will be short on offers.

[Spire-Power]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Amazing how everybody looks good when we win. Hird has been played at CH dozens of times and hasn't made the grade - he isn't likely to do any better at a higher level.
It may be the case that PC is playing him in the midfield with a view to offering another contract. He's probably OK away from home, in the absence of Ryan, to stiffen up the defence a bit, but in home games when we're likely to be playing a packed defence his lack of creativity rules him out - he's not the bloke to un-pick a tight defence.
I wouldn't be too concerned to see him re-sign on that basis for something a lot less than he's presumably on now, but there will be are a lot of decent players out there looking for a job. We should aim higher than somebody who hasn't commanded a regular spot in L2.
Personally I'd rather keep Togwell, but he doesn't seem to be the flavour of the month.

Ryan is obviously a more progressive player with better link-up play through midfield though I wouldnt say unpicking tight defences is his forte. Hird can play a better defensive mid role than Togwell (who won't play higher than L2 again imo) and there could be a place for Hird as cover if the money is right for the club.

[Sabreman]

Mr Mercury, on 14 April 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

That's the actual gist of the thread..folk realise, and possibly Hird as well, that his last deal was a once in a career deal...but his versatility and general competence would be well worth it next season, in League One, if a reduced offer was tabled and accepted!

Agree 100%

[Spire-Power]

Mr Mercury, on 14 April 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

That's the actual gist of the thread..folk realise, and possibly Hird as well, that his last deal was a once in a career deal...but his versatility and general competence would be well worth it next season, in League One, if a reduced offer was tabled and accepted!

Shame you had to point that out as it should have been obvious

[Andy Spireite]

All this talk of Hird being on "the deal of a lifetime" and all other such assertions about his alleged high wages are pure guess work on our part yet it's being announced on here post after post as absolute fact.

Yes, he may well be on a wedge or we may have got a bargain, I have no idea.

Whilst he's had his sticky patches in his time here, overall I think he's generally had a positive contribution.

[h again]

Phil V 72, on 14 April 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

Wasn't Hird in central defence for the first 10 games or so, plus didn't he also play for Donny in The Championship?

He may not have met expectations but to say he hasn't made the grade is a little harsh.

If he'd made the grade he'd still be playing there. He was poor last season and he was poor at the start of this one. PC must have thought all his birthdays had come at once when Evatt came along, and he was at fault for bringing him in too soon, a fact he acknowledged himself. What he was too polite to say was that Hird's form left him very little alternative.
We need to sign players who are a division better than those we have. Hird's only possible position now is in the midfield, but can anybody honestly say that he improved us in any way when he came on at Wembley or against Newport? The reverse was the case. At the right price, very low, there might be a case to give him a year as some sort of defensive midfield cover, but we can surely do better.

[jack bauer]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Amazing how everybody looks good when we win. Hird has been played at CH dozens of times and hasn't made the grade - he isn't likely to do any better at a higher level.
It may be the case that PC is playing him in the midfield with a view to offering another contract. He's probably OK away from home, in the absence of Ryan, to stiffen up the defence a bit, but in home games when we're likely to be playing a packed defence his lack of creativity rules him out - he's not the bloke to un-pick a tight defence.
I wouldn't be too concerned to see him re-sign on that basis for something a lot less than he's presumably on now, but there will be are a lot of decent players out there looking for a job. We should aim higher than somebody who hasn't commanded a regular spot in L2.
Personally I'd rather keep Togwell, but he doesn't seem to be the flavour of the month.

Does he need to be the player to unpick a defence though? Could his holding role allow morsy to do more of that and away from home his disciplined performances could really be an assett. League 1, should we get there, is much more tactical 2 games are tighter, I think his know how and experience could be key.

[h again]

jack bauer, on 14 April 2014 - 09:41 PM, said:

Does he need to be the player to unpick a defence though? Could his holding role allow morsy to do more of that and away from home his disciplined performances could really be an assett. League 1, should we get there, is much more tactical 2 games are tighter, I think his know how and experience could be key.

As next year looks like being one of consolidation at best, we may need to go more defensive. In which case a more defensive midfielder than Jimmy Ryan might be required for away matches.
Which is presumably where Hird might fit in. He wouldn't in my book, because Ryan can win tackles with the best of them, but he does lack a bit of height.
I just don't think we should be offering contracts for the division above to players who haven't been first team regulars this season. Improve or fail.

[Guest_freelander2_*]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 09:47 PM, said:

I just don't think we should be offering contracts for the division above to players who haven't been first team regulars this season.

A great point, agree entirely.

[jack bauer]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 09:47 PM, said:

As next year looks like being one of consolidation at best, we may need to go more defensive. In which case a more defensive midfielder than Jimmy Ryan might be required for away matches.
Which is presumably where Hird might fit in. He wouldn't in my book, because Ryan can win tackles with the best of them, but he does lack a bit of height.
I just don't think we should be offering contracts for the division above to players who haven't been first team regulars this season. Improve or fail.

Hird has though performed consistently well THIS season, he hasnt been a regular not on merit but on cooks preference. I suppose much depends on much here, all parties have to accept the scenario, I just feel his ability, professionalism and experience plus being part of our current squad make him a yes for me but then its nowt to do with what I think.

[Phil V 72]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 09:33 PM, said:

If he'd made the grade he'd still be playing there. He was poor last season and he was poor at the start of this one. PC must have thought all his birthdays had come at once when Evatt came along, and he was at fault for bringing him in too soon, a fact he acknowledged himself. What he was too polite to say was that Hird's form left him very little alternative.

You don't rate him, I can see that but not agreeing with your assessment of 'poor'.
If Cook agrees that bringing Evatt in was a mistake he presumably also thinks dropping Sam was also an error.

[Mr Mercury]

Andy Spireite, on 14 April 2014 - 09:30 PM, said:

All this talk of Hird being on "the deal of a lifetime" and all other such assertions about his alleged high wages are pure guess work on our part yet it's being announced on here post after post as absolute fact.

Yes, he may well be on a wedge or we may have got a bargain, I have no idea.

Whilst he's had his sticky patches in his time here, overall I think he's generally had a positive contribution.

I stand to be corrected but both Richards and Hird turned down new deals at clubs in higher divisions to join us in the basement, I believe Richards was even quoted in the potteries local press saying he didnt want to leave but the deal on offer just couldn't be turned down. So although actual figures will always be a matter for conjecture I think it pretty fair to assume that the contracts on offer were, shall we say, rather good for a player in League two.

[JonB]

Didnt Hird join us on the back of being Donnys player of the year in the Championship and they wanted to keep him but at the time couldnt finance a deal as they were all over the shop.

[Wooden Spoon]

h again, on 14 April 2014 - 09:47 PM, said:

As next year looks like being one of consolidation at best, we may need to go more defensive. In which case a more defensive midfielder than Jimmy Ryan might be required for away matches.
Which is presumably where Hird might fit in. He wouldn't in my book, because Ryan can win tackles with the best of them, but he does lack a bit of height.
I just don't think we should be offering contracts for the division above to players who haven't been first team regulars this season. Improve or fail.

poor at the start of this season when we conceded 3 goals in 8 games with him at CB?

[Andy Spireite]

Mr Mercury, on 15 April 2014 - 06:40 AM, said:

I stand to be corrected but both Richards and Hird turned down new deals at clubs in higher divisions to join us in the basement, I believe Richards was even quoted in the potteries local press saying he didnt want to leave but the deal on offer just couldn't be turned down. So although actual figures will always be a matter for conjecture I think it pretty fair to assume that the contracts on offer were, shall we say, rather good for a player in League two.

In fairness I was talking about Hird not Richards so the example you've given isn't really relevant.

Don't get me wrong, Hird may well be on a fortune but the truth is none of us know. I seem to remember Donny not being able to offer him a deal for some reason or another and perhaps our location and length of deal we were prepared to offer were attractive enough without breaking the bank.

As I said, we just don't know.

[RichThomps1]

Walton Spireite, on 14 April 2014 - 07:41 PM, said:

Get rid far too expensive

Thanks for your well thought out contribution!

[Goku]

It's a pleasure to read such a considered opinion.

[shaun1866]

JonB, on 15 April 2014 - 07:26 AM, said:

Didnt Hird join us on the back of being Donnys player of the year in the Championship and they wanted to keep him but at the time couldnt finance a deal as they were all over the shop.

Thats exactly how I remember it too.